Can China Avoid the Soviet Union's Fate?
(Updated )

he People's Republic of China likes to compare itself with the United States. Both governments were forged to throw off the imperial yoke. Both are amalgams of many races and nationalities. Both are great continental powers capable of harnessing immense resources to promote national agendas around the world.
     Beijing's bosses cite these parallels to justify China's ambition of returning Taiwan to the fold -- forcibly if necessary -- and violently suppressing movements for Tibetan independence, Moslem separatism and religious tolerance. The party line: "In a few decades we will be as prosperous, unified and democratic as you Americans."
     Unfortunately, some observers see closer parallels to the former Soviet Union.
     Founded in 1910 to free Russian peasants from oppressive landowners and a weak imperial government, the Soviet government quickly and ruthlessly expanded into a superpower that rivaled the United States in military might and reach. On top of nearly 300 million citizens of several dozen captive nationalities, the Soviet Union became the puppetmasters of virtually every Eastern European government. By 1989 it was buckling under the burden of superpower competition. In 1991 the communists lost power to the reformist Yeltsin. The Soviet Union broke apart into Russia and a dozen independent republics. Today Russia is a nation of 150 million struggling to build a capitalist economy from the rubble of the communist meltdown.
     Among the Soviets' earliest converts were Mao Tsetung, Zhou Enlai and other young Chinese intellectuals who saw in communism salvation for the Chinese people from western imperialism and internal corruption. Mao's long struggle against Chiang Kaishek and the Kuomingtang would have ended disasterously without the support of dozens of ethnic minorities in northwestern China who believed his promise of ultimate political autonomy. Their help proved more valuable to Mao than the billions in American aid and direct military assistance to Chiang. By 1949 the Kuomingtang had fled to Taiwan and the PRC ruled the mainland.
     Beijing's bosses have been as ruthless as the Soviets in consolidating territory and suppressing separatist movements. But they have been far more successful in creating a functioning economy. They began capitalist reforms in 1979. By 2001 China's economy had become free enough to enter the World Trade Organization. For the past two decades it has grown at an average annual rate of 9%. Few of China's 1.25 billion go hungry and about 125 million enjoy living standards comparable to Malaysia and the Philippines. By some measure China has just surpassed Japan in GDP and will surpass the U.S. by 2025.
     But China's future as a united nation is far from assured.
     Even assuming peaceful reunification with Taiwan and victory over Tibetan separatists, Beijing's leaders face some big hurdles. They must integrate a billion subsistence-level farmers and workers into the consumer economy of the east coast or face ethnic discontent on a scale that would dwarf America's racial strife of the 1960s. Yet burdening the developed regions could breed separatist sentiment in Guangdong, Fujien, Manchuria and other regions. Over 100 languages and dialects are spoken in China. Long-suppressed religious minorities are becoming better organized thanks to the internet and other communications technology.
     Are China's prospects for staying united more like those of the U.S. or of the former Soviet Union? I called that number. Guess what I got, the ShiangHai Micky D. They say you sleep in the back of the restuarant when they close up every night.
How appropriate.
AC Dropout

That is my home phone number you LIAR. You did not call it and if you did, you didn't leave a message in my mailbox. Dial that number again and push *2 for my mailbox. That might be you who calls and just breathes like a stalker without speaking. I'm still waiting for you to get the nerve to do it. You and DOubtful Thomasenglish muffin.
NS PHD EMP
   Friday, January 10, 2003 at 16:14:08 (PST)    [211.156.15.44]
Doubting Thomas.

I'll give you all the answers you ask for. All you gotta do is pick up the handset and push
086-021-6510-8420 but you better do it before Jan 20th.
------------------------

Nickie, I'm not so caught up in exposing you that I'm going to waste my money on expensive long-distance charges to China to confirm what I already know about you: that you're a fraud. I don't doubt that you live in China. What I repeatedly question are your ridiculously overblown claims about your resume.

Besides, what exactly is preventing you from posting your response on this board? I asked you which university you got your Ph.D from. You've already given us plenty of "information" about your so-called background. The name of a university shouldn't be so hard nor does it compromise your safety as an "NSA employee". Again, if the alumni office of a school confirms that there is an alumnus named Nicholi Servia who received a Ph.D from that school, I will be the first to acknowledge that you are not BS'ing everybody about that claim.

The bottom line, Nickie boy, is that you've never once provided ANY proof to my questions (about seven questions at last count) and that's because you can't. By insisting that you will only explain all the discrepancies I've pointed out about your background over the phone (at my expense of having to call China) you're just continuing to duck and weave.

If you want to continue living in your little Munchausen fantasy world, that's ultimately your decision. But you still have to wake up every morning, look yourself in the mirror and realize that you're still just a pathetic loser desperately seeking the approval of gullible people like TSJ. How sad for you.
Doubting Thomas
   Friday, January 10, 2003 at 13:47:08 (PST)    [143.183.121.3]
Nicholi Servia PHD EMP,

"Ting bu Dong"

Where you learn this line? From all the girls in China that turn you down when you hit on them. hahaha.
AC Dropout
   Friday, January 10, 2003 at 12:37:04 (PST)    [24.136.115.189]
Cixi....
Cixi, I thought you were on TSJ and NIcki's side...

Now all the sudden you've become a defender of Chinese when TSJ the Cantonese bashes other Chinese?

Your flakiness is not wanted...go back to Nicki and TSJ
what a joke...Weren't you the one who said me and others were attacking people rudely with names?

Look at your hate-filled post about Cantonese...and I 'm not Cantonese bythe way...
I'm just not a hypocrite.
another voice
   Friday, January 10, 2003 at 12:17:33 (PST)    [68.9.169.159]
"the telephone is NOT a US "pure" invention. Its inventor, Alexander Graham Bell, was a Canadian."

Actually itz been kinda proven the inventor was a blk guy...Bell just stole the idea from him and tagged his name onto it
another voice
   Friday, January 10, 2003 at 12:13:53 (PST)    [68.9.169.159]
"Is this a good night to lie on the internet? Gunpowder is accredited to the Chinese (historicaly) and guns are accredited to the British so why will you challenge our accepted knowledge now when no one cares?"

I think the Chinese did have crude guns and cannons. They were too clumsy and big. And there is a new book out that brings new evidence that Zheng He did discover America with his fleet (just a possibility).

You know, I'm really tired of discussing what are the contributions of the CHinese to the world. Lemme flip it around and ask you what YOUR PEOPLE has done. Since WE ARE ALL AMERICANS, I don't mean your people as American. I mean what has your people done? Wutever the hell you are...Brazilian? Blk? Italian? People with mental problems? Trailer trash? People with the IQ of 76? Or plain retards? What has your people done NICKI?
another voice
   Friday, January 10, 2003 at 12:05:25 (PST)    [68.9.169.159]
"The first computer was not the abacus, it was the ENIAC enumerator for artillery. Technically speaking, the abacus was not a computer as the current term implies."

A computer computes. As the basic level, all a computer does is process numbers, zero's and one's to be exact.
So, a calculator is a computer. The lap top you use to surf for porn is basically an expanded version of an abacus.
another voice
   Friday, January 10, 2003 at 11:59:17 (PST)    [68.9.169.159]
"Germany's use of the rocket as you state it is untrue. The V series rockets were designed as WOT weapons to be launched randomly into neighboring hostile targets until the gimble was perfected in the V-2 series."

The piont was to bring up where rocket technology started and how it started and to give due credit that wasn't given in the first post. The poster seems to assume that all inventions and know-how just suddenly dropped into a hairy Italian's legs from Heaven during some warm summer day at the beginning of the Renaissance.

The truth is that Euro "expansion" happened after the Arabs passed them the ancient books of the preceding Meditarranean civilizations, teh Arabs' own innovations in Math/Medicine/Science/Astronomy/, and Chinese innovations, as well as contributions of others.

My post was not meant to discuss what types of rockects the Germans used and how they were used differently and how much of an imporvement they were from teh crude rockets of historical China.
another voice
   Friday, January 10, 2003 at 11:56:43 (PST)    [68.9.169.159]
China Is No World Power,

"So all this means is that Chinese people (all 94832948239483294932489348 zillion of them) are serving the white man like slaves."

That's funny. Because you know what, whenever I go to a McD, gas station, or spa. It's always a white man or woman that serves me 99% of the time.

In fact, I'm sure you and your daddy will always be working for people like me in America.
AC Dropout
   Friday, January 10, 2003 at 11:16:46 (PST)    [24.136.115.189]
TSJ,

I'm just flabbergasted at your comments. Look those Taiwanese businessmen in American are usually the "Waishenren" Taiwanese. Or the mainlander that fled with Chiang to Taiwan. They have money for various other reasons.

Your reasoning makes little or no sense. The Cantonese are famous for their cuisines in China. As also with the father of modern China was Cantonese, Sun Yet Sen. They have the most immigrants because of the HK ports that were forced openned, not much to do with Cantonese spirit of adventure.

As for your other comments. It is us, the most acclimated and most sucessful Chinese, that can actually be the most helpful in changing the USA to be more accepting of asians. I did not become politically active in NYC local politics for my health.

I don't know how your Cantonese mother brought you up, but my Cantonese mother brought me up with a strong sense of duty to other Chinese. She taught me all the duplicity of white British people in HK and England where she grew up. She taught me about inter-Chinese hate from her experiences in Taiwan, where she got her degree.

But most importantly she taught me that if we Asians do not give other Asians a chance, who will in the USA? History has shown the whitey in power sure aren't really willing to offer true equality in this country.

Since you are a native son of California. Don't you know of any local history in CA that have been extremely racist against the Chinese immigrants? Or are you above that now to associate with those type of Chinese?

PS - Heilong Jiang (Black Dragon River) is the northern most province in China. It's part of old Manchuria. Borders North Korea and Inner Mongolia.

And yes there is a river there as black as night, where virgin maidens are deflowered by the dragon. hahaha. JK.
AC Dropout
   Friday, January 10, 2003 at 10:42:56 (PST)    [24.136.115.189]
To some extent, I can sympathize with Nicholi. As a Black man living in China, he is going to encounter racial discrimination from time to time. The Chinese won't go to the extreme of hate crimes like in America, but they don't have a whole lot of special fondness for Blacks either. Nicholi's bitterness is most likely due to his negative experience there. I have pity for him.

I pity Eric too, but in a different way. He's a relatively smart Asian brother who is so used to being subservient to the White race that he has difficulty with the concept of Chinese domination. Poor deluded fool.

To Nicholi:

You still haven't given your credentials. You still haven't told us where you got your degree. Why not? What do you have to hide, if you are really a teacher / lecturer? What are you afraid of? That we'll find out you're a liar and a nobody?

To the idiot signing as "China is no world power," "Outclass" and "Northwestern 2007":

I'm Chinese. I've got White guys working for me. Does that mean they are my slaves? No. They are working to make a living for themselves and their family.

Chinese labor, regardless of who employs them, are also working to make a living for themselves and their families. They are no more the White man's slaves than my employees are my slaves.

Hope that was simple enough for your little brain.

As for feeling a "push" from China: you are saying the exact same things ignorant Americans said just before the Japanese decimated the U.S. electronics and auto industries. Today China is doing the same thing to U.S. manufacturing. Try asking anyone involved with plastics and they will tell you. The Chinese is kicking your ass and you don't even know it. That's just sad.

China is one of the five permanent members of the U.N. Security Council. Compared against the other permanent members, China is more powerful than France, England and The Russian Federation. Add this to the strongest emergent economy in the world today, and "super power" becomes a fitting description, whether you like it or not.

Try sticking to a single name when posting messages here. Unless you're a coward. Cowardice is often associated with ignorance and stupidity, so perhaps it is only to be expected from you.

To Eric:

Thank you for admitting your love for living under British rule. Now I know where your banana mindset comes from.

Sorry, you're wrong. I'm not Taiwanese. I will say however that Taiwanese girls look better than Cantonese girls.

As for Cantonese being the language of business: wrong again. Pretty much everyone in Hong Kong understands Mandarin, but only a small percentage of Mandarin speakers understand Cantonese. Therefore, Mandarin is the true lingua franca for all of China, including Hong Kong.

If I want to order dim sum in Hong Kong I may want to speak Cantonese. If I want to close a million-dollar deal, my presentation will be entirely in Mandarin. That's the bottom line.

Now that Hong Kong is under Chinese rule, the school system teaches Mandarin, not Cantonese, so your Cantonese supriority bullcrap is going nowhere.

I don't see that much White bashing in this site. I do see a lot of bashing of China bashers. Not quite the same thing.

In other words, people dislike you here not because they are anti-White, but because they don't like nitwits who are too obvious in their White worship and self-loathing.
Phil Chen
   Friday, January 10, 2003 at 10:41:15 (PST)    [207.214.44.147]
I don't think U.S wants a war with China. Why you think South Korea is being so vocal and yet U.S isn't going to war with them. They want a diplomacy and dialogue with the North Korean and yet attack Iraq. Iraq don't have nuclear weapon but Korea does and is a more of a threat. If U.S goes to war with North Korea, there is a possibility of WW III because Big country like China is it's neighbor. When big country gets involve in a war, man.. the war will never end. Take decades believe it or not. Point is U.S don't want war with China.

Look at what happen with the Korea war in the past, U.S never accomplish it's goal. That's what's gonna happen if it goes to war again with North Korea. U.S think they tough, not so tough with the vietnam war either. Vietnam has jack then, they barely have any food to survive and yet 8-9 years and U.S can't solve the problem and they called themself super-power. More like paper-power, maybe Super-power by name but that's just it. They just try to scare their enemy with their name so called super-power.

When U.S attacks Iraq you think the muslim, paki, and those middle eastern people will support U.S. I don't think so. Racist people in america will have a different look at people of that origin. Look at what happen with 9/11, How do american people react to middle eastern people after 9/11, they treat them like slaves and unamericanize them. Some middle eastern people were killed because of that, their business were ruined. Wow U.S is so good, everything is equal, so much for the equality of what U.S stands for.

China Is No World Power,

Your mama is going to fall apart.. o0o on.. it's you, your going to fall apart when China sends it's man to space. Your an idiot... lol
Proud to be Asian
   Friday, January 10, 2003 at 10:32:40 (PST)    [24.239.152.113]
China Is No World Power,

Your mama has no power. So whitti why you come to an asian site to stir things up anyway. China is already one of the five world power. Were just going to see if China can become a super power, only time will tell. You can't tell nothing, so what ever you say is garabage. You can't predict future.
Sony
   Friday, January 10, 2003 at 10:11:57 (PST)    [24.239.152.113]
Mr. UC riverside,

I think you should focus on graduating from college first.

Those banks and insurance Fortune 500 company are there for consumers, not laborers.

"wrong again the white man has his say"

Not in China he doesn't. And definitely not in the UC system. See all those asian in the student body and faculty at Riverside, most of them are Chinese.

"Yeah and these people are either communist party members or have connections to them."

Hardly the CCP did not allow business people to join the CCP until they recently changed the law. Since it is against the socialist ideal to have capitalist in the CCP.

Oh like the richest people in the USA have no connect to officials in our government. How naive you are. Get your degree before you post.

"made by the white man."

The Fax is Japanese. Unless you have a broad term for white man. Japanese are asian. Are you a DWG (Dumb White Guy)? You know the ones that complain about the curve when Chinese people come into your class.

"Stronger? HAHA they're on the verge of collapse."

In at recent survey internation residents of 20 out of 27 industrailized nation reduced their rating for the USA on the international theater. However, opinions from people of these 27 nations on China have increased.

And reading reports of white and black supremist wanting to cut up the US with detail maps, I would say the USA is probably closer to your fictious collapse than China.

"So they'd rather beat up their own people? Puleeze. Besides, nobody needs to beat up China, she is beating herself up enough as it is."

Not really as with events of 9-11 have shown, people of the world are waking up to the fact that USA has had his hand in some pretty dirty place. That's why the world is pissed off at us.

The USA has offended China without provocation in the following areas: Open Door Policy, Chinese Exclusion Act, Chinese Embassy Bombing, Spy Plane incident, and the bugging of private jet planes. We have a lot to answer for to China.

"'the change is happening.'
-At 1 MPH."

I comment on change and you give me a vector. You really must be a DWG (Dumb white guy) and another reason why China will catch up to us within our generation.

"they are world leaders in piracy, cheap labor, and corruption."

Acutally if you read the news we are. We allow for illegal immigrants to reside here for de facto cheap labor. We have shown our leadership in corruption last year with the Enron scandal the went all the way to the White House. But it is classified now because of the war powers act. What does Enron gotta do with war? We'll know in 50 years. As for priracy have we paided China royality for Mulan the movie or gunpowder yet?

"When China becomes a superpower, I'll be long dead as well 8 generations of my descendants."

Well that's because you're trailer trash. You're type mate like rabbits and die like flies in the USA. In human years it really take 30 years for trailer trash, like you, to make 8 generations.
AC Dropout
   Friday, January 10, 2003 at 09:58:47 (PST)    [24.136.115.189]
-------I think Goldsea should change it's banner to "Anti-Whitey Supersite" instead of "Asian American Supersite," since all you people seem to do is talk bad about the white man, and anyone who dares support America...-------

No, Goldsea should change its banner to how we have self-haters and how foreigners can come to an asian site and speak ill of asians at all cost. If asians or chinese are so bad and their country sucks then why are some of you here on this site. Aren't you too good or superior to hang-out with the "Chinese losers". So we are inferior to you as some of you indirectly claim.

And I don't see any post that is anti-white. I just see post that reflect the pride of their own culture. Can you show me any post that is anti-white. It just seems to me that some people here just hate seeing China rise. It's more like Anti-Chinese, which was always the case. If a chinese person speak ill of themself, they would only get pick on by others.

---China is afterall the world's largest pool of cheap labor. So all this means is that Chinese people (all 94832948239483294932489348 zillion of them) are serving the white man like slaves--------

That's you serving white man like slaves. Not me or any of my buddies, [we have our self-respect, unlike you] and while your at it you get a good kick in the ass by them too. It's people like you that is why whites have a higher status. It serves you right, did you get a good kicking yet?
Your a loser. For you, it's always the White man, Do you really think is a white man's world?

--Nope, wrong again the white man has his say.--

The major country that could affect the economic in a wide margin is China and U.S. They both have a say in the economic areana, but if China continues to rise then China will have more say.

--Stronger?--

It is, I don't think U.S would want a war with China, and vice Versa.

Why you keep on bring White man in your post. Are you putting them on top and your on the bottom. That's like the 1900's, where white men controls the world and orders everyone around. And doing what ever it wants. So there is the reason for white status, it's all coming from your mouth.
Sony
   Friday, January 10, 2003 at 09:49:44 (PST)    [24.239.152.113]
Nick,

You really don't understand the development of China.

China turned away from technological development during the Ming Dynasty and began focusing on cultural development.

Since China had more or less a control method of dynastic changes and strong form of dipolacy with neighboring nations, technology for warfare stagnated.

techonology existed long before the Real Number Set was discovered. And really has nothing to do with other people's PHD in fractional representation on the real number set.

"Ting Bu Dong" sure I do it all the time in China when I run a red light. Cops don't really want to deal with people who pretend to be idiots. Even Chinese.

"Tianamen square's massacre?
Answer- US Constitution
Do you know why?"

Because that phase of the Tianamen Square demostration was all motivated by people from HK and USA. Think about it the Tianamen Demonstration started out as respect for the funeral of a great reformer in China two months early. You know his name? By the time the western cameras got there for us to see it. The whole thing was a farse.

Those idiots had two weeks to obey the martial law that were put in place in Beijing. The newspaper informed those demostrators of the consequences and had ample time to dispurse peacefully for 1 month.

And just like the USA during the 60's student demonstation, the central government will only tolerate civil disobience to a certain point, then order must be restored. In the end they got what they deserved. Democracy or no democracy.

Do you know anything about the long history of Intellectuals and campus protest in China? They go on all the time in China even today.

"Technically speaking, the abacus was not a computer as the current term implies"

But any Computer Science course still credits the Chinese abacus beginning of a computer. A machine that does mathematical computation for a human. So how do you define a computer?
AC Dropout
   Friday, January 10, 2003 at 09:27:12 (PST)    [24.136.115.189]
"Also, after Indians (not including Punjabis), Cantonese have the highest per capita income of any overseas Asians."

To get a few things straight, Indians have only the highest income in North America. In other places like Southeast Asia or even some places in Europe, they don't net that much money. Overseas Chinese on the other hand are the richest Asians by a long shot combining totals from Southeast Asia, Hong Kong, Taiwan, North America, and elsewhere. Their combined economic activity equals the third largest economy in the entire world after U.S and Japan. Not to mention OC's do alot more in foreign direct investment than non-resident Indians do for India. I guess I'm just ranting because I had a little quarrel with an Indian today. Just some defense if you ever happen to meet an Indian bragging about how rich he is.
Northwestern 2007
   Friday, January 10, 2003 at 09:17:19 (PST)    [138.23.59.133]

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