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GOLDSEA |
ASIAMS.NET |
ASIAN AMERICAN ISSUES
IS THE AA GENDER DIVIDE REAL?
(Updated
Wednesday, Jan 22, 2025, 06:38:56 AM)
sian American women are abandoning AA men by the millions. Young AA women seek out any race of men but their own. Women like Amy Tan write books and make movies that dump on AA men and glorify Asian women in relationships with white men.
That's the perception of many AA men.
On what do they blame this state of affairs? Brainwashing by media that play up white men while cutting Asian men off at the knees. Desire for payback by AA women who feel slighted by their families and Asian society. Large numbers of non-Asian men with blind fetishes for Asian women. Some even acknowledge that Asian men are often too fixed in their ideas of how a woman should look and behave, causing many AF to feel devalued.
Other Asian Americans see AF outmarriage rates as merely a natural state of affairs for a 4% minority population that includes many recent immigrants. The outmarriage gender gap will narrow as growing Asian population centers provide ready access to bigger pools of singles. Besides outmarriage is't the same as rejecting one's racial identity, they argue. Many AF who outmarry retain strong identification with their Asian identity.
Is there really an Asian American gender divide? Is so, what's behind it? If not, what's behind the perception?
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WHAT YOU SAY
[This page is closed to new input. --Ed.]
Deconstructing "Roger"
Let’s generalize a bit further beyond "Roger" the individual. There is a phenomenon of white male losers frequenting Asian American internet sites and discussion groups. It occurs with every forum I have ever seen. These interlopers seem to take on numerous, but well-defined guises:
1) Openly racist rants and advertisements for racist organizations/sites - generally kept to a minimum on moderated forums such as Goldsea but pretty rampant on unmoderated forums such as s.c.a.a.
2) Covert but more or less biased attacks on an ethnic group. Again, widespread on unmoderated forums but kept to low levels on moderated boards; I suspect Goldsea’s editors let these slip through occasionally to provoke a response
3) "Role play", in which the white male assumes the identity of a minority person (male or female), and proceeds to play that role to match their racist notions. For example, some of the "Janet Chang" / AF sellout type posts on here are probably WMs. Similarly, I recall a polemic posted to s.c.a.a. which claimed to be from an AM, advising "other AMs" to be submissive and "grateful" to "naturally superior" WMs. And so on.
4) Combination "role play" and racism: presumably to sow dissension among minority groups. For example, claim to be Asian, then post racist stuff about other Asians, Jews, blacks and Hispanics. If you have read s.c.a.a. recently, you know there is someone posting a huge amount of anti-Semitic material under an Asian name handle. Another poster claims to be Korean and spews hate against Chinese.
5) Reverse discrimination: claim that everyone’s viewpoint is "racist" against "whites". Pretty popular one. Sometimes they’ll get a conversation going with themselves, role play a militant minority member bullying the white guy, to "prove" their point.
6) "There isn’t any racism in America": the clueless approach. Deny it all. If I don’t see it, it doesn’t exist.
7) Asiaphiles - "I’ve always been fascinated by Oriental culture and I hope to meet that special Lady to make my life complete with her exotic, submissive ways." Or, "I’m a WM dating/married to an AF, therefore I cannot be a racist. Let me tell you my opinion about that…" [insert racist opinion here]. Self explanatory.
Why do these people make the effort? The amount of time spent on these activities is not negligible. Think about it. Most visitors to an ethnic website don’t post anything. Lurkers outnumber posters by a large margin. When I visit a black ethnic site, I don’t post anything. I know that I have never experienced what black Americans go through, and I think the crap that blacks endure is worse than what we get as Asians. So I don’t think I have a whole lot to contribute to their discussion, but I do find it interesting to see the black perspective. All of us should learn from the experience of African Americans, especially the whites who visit those sites. And I think the majority do so. Most whites are not actively racist. They unconsciously benefit from white privilege; but most don’t even know what the term means. It is commendable that they should try to learn more about the minority experience.
But "Roger" and his ilk are not here for education. Far from it. They are here to exercise their white privilege, wrapped in the anonymous cloak of the Internet and free of any social stigma of racism, however light that stigma may be. Overt racists and covert racists are pretty easy to explain; these are the same type of people who march in white sheets, burn crosses and want to take a "white homeland" and secede from the Union. Usually these are the dregs of society who feel so low in status that the only way they can elevate themselves is to systematically lower the status of others who do not fit their criteria. Some are in "respectable" positions and cannot express these opinions at work or in social circles; thus, they use the Internet to release their true feelings. "Role players" are a different sort; less likely to be true racists, these people enjoy the feeling of masquerade and deception, combined with the freedom to express their biases without repercussions. Some role players are more sophisticated racists who are actively trying to disrupt relations between minorities; these people understand the demographic trends which are going to make European Americans a minority during this century. They want to prevent blacks, hispanics and Asians from forming any political alliances.
Deniers and reverse discrimination "victims" are a diverse crowd. Often, those who feel the loss of white privilege cry that they are being discriminated against. What they don’t understand is that they are not experiencing active discrimination against them in most cases, but rather the loss of the unspoken white privilege they previously enjoyed. I know a WM who is a good guy, but at his job (a branch of the state government), blacks now outnumber whites. He constantly complains about alleged racially motivated actions of the director of his agency. Yet when I asked him what he thought it was like for black employees at a predominantly white employer, all I got was a blank stare. This is not a stupid guy, but he has no insight into the matter. Similarly, the denier WM may not be actively racist, but may be totally unaware of minority issues in America. It’s like ignorance of Asian history; on this forum, I can recall various WMs who assumed the Roman Empire was militarily and technologically superior to the Han Empire. Of course, they were soundly refuted. But if I recall my own "World History" courses in school, one could certainly come away with the impression that Western Civilization was the Only Civilization, superior to all others in every way. Again, inherent white privilege in American education. It may be useful to enlighten these people, to educate and make them realize that maybe - just maybe, there are issues that they don’t quite understand and are an unfortunate consequence of biases in American society. You can’t correct the problem if you aren’t aware of it.
Let’s examine the efforts of our favorite verbal punching bag. "Roger" displays the characteristics of a denier. He attacks one small part of one argument, then calls any response irrelevant. He doesn’t openly endorse any particular bias, but the sum of his statements is to deny that bias in American media can affect one segment of a minority population. When presented with evidence to the contrary, his only response is to question the relevance of such evidence, based on demographic data and his vast experience of life as an Asian American. Except that he’s not Asian American, he’s a white male. And his analysis of Asian American demographics? "AAs cluster." Ooops. Let’s substitute "whites" for "AAs": "Whites cluster." How much sense does that make? When a denier continues denying to the extent that "Roger" has, he’s usually not salvageable. I hope the exposition has educated other people, because "Roger" seems hopeless. A less favorable interpretation would be that "Roger" is intentionally obtuse because he is covertly racist and the position he takes is really a front for a disparaging opinion of AMs. villageidiot seems to take this view. Let’s hope "Roger" isn’t racist, just stupid.
"Roger" also displays some characteristics of a "reverse discrimination victim": when dealing with my statement that "most whites don’t think there is much racism in America", he states that Goldsea is rife with racism of various sorts. So, in "Roger’s" opinion, Asian Americans are the racists and he is the victim. Of course, he doesn’t state that in so many words, because that would lead to a predictable response. He couches it in his usual camouflage of confusing logorrhea.
So I invite "Roger" to post away, which he is sure to do. We’ve seen it all before. Privileged, predictable, paltry, and pathetic.
Miscegenation is great
Monday, February 11, 2002 at 12:39:26 (PST)
Hi, Misc,
You've been busy. I'm flattered.
Since the bulk of your rather lengthy monologue is addressed to the demon in your head, rather than to me, I'll leave it to him to respond. That way, too, I won't have to charge you tuition.
If you're going to keep running around in circles, Misc, you're going to have to do it without me.
Make a point and I'll be happy to address it.
Roger
Sunday, February 10, 2002 at 18:24:24 (PST)
Why is this Roger guy even on the ASIAN board???? this is about ASIAN issues, as i said before, go to ther other 99.9999% of the web that caters to you !!!! Go Away!!
Asian Sting
Sunday, February 10, 2002 at 13:22:17 (PST)
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