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ASIAMS.NET |
ASIAN AMERICAN ISSUES
IS THE AA GENDER DIVIDE REAL?
(Updated
Wednesday, Jan 22, 2025, 06:38:55 AM)
sian American women are abandoning AA men by the millions. Young AA women seek out any race of men but their own. Women like Amy Tan write books and make movies that dump on AA men and glorify Asian women in relationships with white men.
That's the perception of many AA men.
On what do they blame this state of affairs? Brainwashing by media that play up white men while cutting Asian men off at the knees. Desire for payback by AA women who feel slighted by their families and Asian society. Large numbers of non-Asian men with blind fetishes for Asian women. Some even acknowledge that Asian men are often too fixed in their ideas of how a woman should look and behave, causing many AF to feel devalued.
Other Asian Americans see AF outmarriage rates as merely a natural state of affairs for a 4% minority population that includes many recent immigrants. The outmarriage gender gap will narrow as growing Asian population centers provide ready access to bigger pools of singles. Besides outmarriage is't the same as rejecting one's racial identity, they argue. Many AF who outmarry retain strong identification with their Asian identity.
Is there really an Asian American gender divide? Is so, what's behind it? If not, what's behind the perception?
This interactive article is closed to new input.
Discussions posted during the past year remain available for browsing.
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WHAT YOU SAY
[This page is closed to new input. --Ed.]
would u guys listen to yourself?! on this page of the forum alone, i have counted three people who have confirmed that white male are appealed to asian female b/c we are "easy"?!! where do ya'll get off saying this? all you who really think this, should be disgusted at yourself for making such accusations about YOUR OWN KIND w/o supporting evidences.
i highly doubt "easiness" is a reason ANY guy would be attracted to ANY female. if this was true, guys would be searching for mates at whorehouses rather than churches.
from my understanding, non-asian males are attracted to af b/c we possess HIGHER ethnical values than females of other cultures. they admire the fact that we respect the elders, they adore the submissive qualities in asian females, they value our diligent traits, and most of all..they are drawn to us b/c we are NOT 'loose'. they are also attracted to our petite physique and 'exoticness'.
there are also non-asian males who have LITTLE understanding of the asian culture...yet still fantasize about asian females. this is b/c the media has a tendency to portray asian females as SEXUAL OBJECTS. hence, asian males are portrayed as dorks.
there is no question, that the media's inaccurate depiction of asian americans is a problem. it is also true that the media has SOME influence on the public. however, the media do not control our minds...we are smart enough to decide for ourselves, what is acceptable and what is not.
some think they're doing good by blaming the media for cultural bias, or resenting white males for their attractions to asian females, or bashing asian females for being "sell-outs" (whoever created this term is a racist bigot)..and worst of all..hating on bi-racial people for being themselves. if you think this would lead you anywhere...you need to GROW UP!! asian americans have the highest enrollment in the ivies, and the highest annual income. use this to your advantage people! fight with your minds...not your mouth or fist.
be
Monday, March 04, 2002 at 01:12:10 (PST)
You know what???...I am So sick of those armchair self proclaim experts on why asian men are losing out on the "dating game" if they aren't ranting about the media it's the asian men ain't aggressive enough bullshit again ....please who the hell made those people such experts? just because they saw a few asian guys looking kinda geeky and shy doesn't MAKE the whole friggin Asian male race like that!!!
The reality is most Asian guys don't have a problem when comes to dating
AF or even WF just as most white or black guys...no race is better or worse and anybody who says otherwise is an idiot!
A-man
Sunday, March 03, 2002 at 22:24:46 (PST)
Morris:
Werd. Being caught on the wrong side of the media train is a prime reason for the uphill battle AM's face. 'TLC' and 'be' are just attacking a 'strawman' by putting into your mouth words you never said nor implied.
NHB:
You can't out-sneak the shifty-eyed Asians, white boy. No need to intersperse your writing with awkward allusions to being an AM.
Max da cat:
All of your messages implicitly assume that people on this board are directing their messages at white America for obtaining sympathy or redress, to which your clever response is "deal with it." Why would we address white America in this forum? Even if you are correct in saying that AM's should "deal with it," that doesn't entail we must deal with it as individuals rather than enlisting fellow AM's to the same cause, which is OBVIOUSLY what we are doing. Duh.
To all:
I see the gender divide is not restricted to my own city. But, I think here in Vancouver we have a problem that you folks in CA or NY do not have. Not only is the media a factor in making AM's less attractive to AF's in Vancouver, the fact that this is a city with 50% Asians, nearly all fobs, along with the attendent dysfunctional first-generation family structure... and you have quite a lopsided state of affairs where 100% of English-speaking AF's exclusively date WM's! There is no sub-culture of AA's like you have in CA or NY for a young AF to become a part of... nor are there any 2nd generation families where the parents don't have their heads stuck up their asses pretending they're living in Asia.
Vancouver Canuck
Sunday, March 03, 2002 at 21:31:07 (PST)
Morris,
One thing you got to keep in mind is that most Arabs and Persians can easily pass off as being white in our race conscious society. This is reflected in the dating patterns. Yes, Arabs are depicted in the same dehumanizing and desexualized images as Asian men are. But, at the same time, I have seen many hot white chicks drool after these same Arabs.
it's not fair
Sunday, March 03, 2002 at 21:28:59 (PST)
T H Lien
"Also, until I went to high school, every stereotype about Black people, Chinese, Filipinos, Malaysians etc. came from my Asian mother. Based on my observations, I tend to doubt my situation was the exception."
Well good for you for having a narrow minded low-class mother. Based on YOUR observations of the low-class people you and your mother associated with, of course your situation was not the exception. I could see you're turning out just like her, a BA POR. You sound like a loose lipped old lady, spilling out everything for the whole world to see.
Unlike you, my Asian parents never had a bad word to say about anyone. The Asian parents of my friends and acquaintances never did either. We were instead taught tolerance and understanding.
You (and sometimes AC Dropout) ARE so annoying. You think you're an expert on Asian this, Asian that including the psyche of hapas!! Then you sneer at anyone who doesn't conform to your idea of what a "true" Asian should be. One thing is for certain, no one including mixed raced children, should be like you! Take a breather and a lesson from Be and Hannybunbun.
more and more arrogant by the minute
Sunday, March 03, 2002 at 21:08:55 (PST)
AA,
If u think about it, AA men have more of an advantage over White men when it comes to finding love. Much of the insecurities that AA men have about themselves are just darn petty. Here's why:
1) AA men overall are more successful than the average White dude. In fact, many of them are making more $$$ and are better educated.
2) Many AA men have a bi-cultural advantage. Being bi-cultural is hip and definately attractive. Do u think women find men to be attractive if they can speak another language fluently besides english? Of course! What about being able to cook those delicious Asian cuisines? I'm sure many women would also find that attractive.
Ok, many whites are "perceived" as better looking. But that doesn't mean a thing because they are many Asians in that category as well!
Btw, I think many of the recent Chinese groups will not assimilate into the American scene. Many of them will create a unique identity and not just take on "the dime in a dozen" AA image. The "opportunistic" and "aggressive" mentality of the recent Chinese groups contrast strongly against the earlier groups who were more subordinate.
AA lost in SD,
I'm not being an ### by saying that AA men are more focused with $$$ than with love. But as a general rule, Asian families strictly foster their sons to be breadwinners but are much more liberal with their daughters. Blame it on our parents not society or the white media....
Asians want to be part of the American scene, many try to "imitate" whites. Asians also want to take a humble role so Whites can accept them. We pay a big price for doing such a thing. Remember, no one is telling us what to do or what kind of people to choose as mates. It's all in our hands, not in the hands of white ppl! They aren't telling us who to date or marry, it's us making the choices. If white ppl in the media portrays Asian men as criminals and murderers, are we to follow that trend in real life?
Asians could follow the path of some Afro Americans by being separatist, but no, we decided to take a subordinate role with whites...
One last thing, America is becoming multicultural and it is inevitable, the whole country doesn't just revolve around white men and their prowess. Asians and Hispanics are the fast growing groups in the US. Many African Americans are becoming more successful by the day. White ppl will face stiffer scrutiny as the years goes by...I don't think their Hollywood and whatever racist medium they want to propagate will destroy us or any other group of people.
Gender Divide varies among the Asian groups
Sunday, March 03, 2002 at 17:04:45 (PST)
i'm so tired of arguing with the AM haters on this web-board, that even when i'm not posting and only reading the AM bashing by AW AND WM really irks me. especially guys like roger or his latest incarnate be makes everything seem really hopeless with all the misunderstanding out there. and often people like asian-american male goes the other extreme. why can't people live and let live?
anyhow, i just saw the latest fox sunday line-up with futurama and king of the hill. now to those roger/be types out there, can you honestly explain to me how the heck is it that even on stupid CARTOON shows the young AM is absent while the AM father in BOTH shows speak with the stereotypical accent (even in FUTURE-rama) and all the other domineering, etc. stereotypes the AM bashers on this board like to use? a cartoon is entirely made by the director and artists, so if the media doesn't perpetuate those horrid AM images then why the crossover even to cartoons?
back to lurking and musing at the idiocy/denial that happens everyday everywhere...
villageidiot
Sunday, March 03, 2002 at 16:13:21 (PST)
"In asian culture, dating is a much more serious matter. An asian guy does not ask a girl as lightly as white guy would. Don't you agree?"
Yes!
Asian American Male
Sunday, March 03, 2002 at 12:18:47 (PST)
T.H. Lien:
Must i always demonstrate your narrow-mindedness to you?
I said earlier: "a person CAN possess a DESIRE to understand their heritage, w/o speaking the language or functioning in the culture. we should give praise to them, as well."
You replied: "Well then, are they actually pursuing that desire?"
I know it takes intense concentration to answer this question...but if you just think, you can do it.
That's all i have to say to you this time.
be
Sunday, March 03, 2002 at 11:21:26 (PST)
Hannybunbun,
First off I'm not talking about other countries, I'm referring to the USA. Also I'm not referring to modern immigration quota. I'm referring that they did not let Chinese women into the country, to ensure the first Coolie Chinese immigrant would not be able to breed or settle down in the USA. USA never did that to any European immigration group that I'm aware of. Talking about how cruel other European countries are towards asian immigrant only furthers the hypothesis that "whites" are evil.
China "re-education" program or USA "McCarthism" Communist hunt. We're both examples of a societies belief that they were trying to improve the society, however contrary history see those peroids. Also in both instances the entire population of the coutry was targetted independent of race. Chinese "re-education" was to break down the class divide in society, because post 1911 society was very class driven like the UK, it did not really work. Because in Asia I have plenty of domestic help that see themselves as another class, even though, I behave very westernized around them and do not believe in class structures as the USA education system taught me.
McCarthism also a similar situation to uproot communism in USA. Didn't really work there are still socialist and communist parties in the USA political landscape.
What I'm referring to as instanses in USA history where asian were unfair singled out with no precident among European immigrant groups. Even Italian, Irish, German, and Jewish immigrants (once considered the dreg of USA society) did not have to put up with half the crap asian did and are considered fully assimilated into the USA mainstream culture. Whereas Asains are still marginalized in USA society.
Individually, human in general are nice people. It is societies' behavior that you need to aware of. If you met a Japanese or German prior to WWII, sure individually they are as humanly nice as the next person. It is experience of a society and how it behaves that one needs to understand. Because injustices are committed by the society not the individual in most instances. The individual usually is just a slave to societial norms.
So the AF that wants to be with an WM is just behaving to societial norms she identifies with. Also conversely, AM's wanting to be with AF's are also behaving with societial norms they identify with.
AC dropout
Sunday, March 03, 2002 at 07:58:58 (PST)
"Think of the word Arab...What image comes to mind??? Someone who is angry, abusive, ugly, sweaty, and down right evil are fairly common images in this country. Yet I have met hundreds of charming, dashing, sophisticated and drop dead good looking Arabs in my day and surprisingly I have met only a few that look anything like what you see in the movies."
Yet, all those charming, dashing, sophisticated and drop deal good looking arabs have no problem at all getting white girls despite how the negative images in the media. I don't think arab americans have this kind of interracial imbalance like Asian americans do. What does this tell you?
Be Said:
"Who influences an individual's decisions more? the people they encounter and interact with in everyday life...or the entertainment industry that portrays fairytale lives? I believe the majority would choose the first one...which means, our views are shaped from our life experiences"
This is so true. Personal contact with an arab american or asian american will dictate to a large degree how a girl perceives arab americans or asian americans, media steroetypes only play a small role.
I total agree with what Sam Sung said:
"AMs will not admit to not being very aggressive. That in itself would be admitting to a certain level of passivity on their part, something they can't acknowledge because of the "passive" stereotype. By blaming the imbalance solely on the media, AFs, etc., they absolve themselves of any and all responsbility."
NHB
Sunday, March 03, 2002 at 06:42:36 (PST)
Asian American Male:
In response to your comment "...Jefferson Davis and murderers such as Nathaniel Bedford Forrest and want me to consider them heroes. That is what high school history books teach children in the south."
I don't know what HS you went to or in what town, but I can tell you that this was not in MY American History Textbook I studied at Baton Rouge Magnet High Back in the 1980s. If anything my Amercian History Teachers had repeatedly blamed the Civil War on Slavery and the US government's unwillingness to buy the freedom of all the slaves or worse, the fact that slavery every started here to begin with.
I am Southern and have ancestors who fought on both sides of the battle, but none of them owned slaves. I personally find the Civil War an abhorrant topic and the fact that we have idiots in places like the States of Mississippi, Alabama and Georgia who will wave that Battle Jack (the true Confederate Flag is the Stars and Bars, that St. Andrews cross was the Battle Flag) in peoples' faces spouting White Supremacist garbage is downright DISGUSTING.
I left the Southeast and moved to Texas to get away from crap like that. However, there was a recent incident in Texas where some punk kid was wearing a Confederate Battle Jack T-Shirt and he was sent home for it because it's considered a racist symbol. His dad and the ACLU raised a stink, which in turn brought out about 150 people from Mississippi to support this piece of White Trash. (This was around the time that Mississippi chose to keep that Battle Jack on their State Flag). The courts upheld the school and the parents are now homeschooling the kid. I need to find his name and submit it to the government because he'll probably turn into the next David Duke or Timothy McVeigh.
Southern White Male who says Lee Surrendered, the CSA Lost, none of us were alive then anyway and we should just get the Hell over it and move on, Goddamn it!!!
Sunday, March 03, 2002 at 05:46:54 (PST)
I just want to add my 2 cents.
America helps Israel w/o question. China aids both Arabs and Israel, but more so the Arabs because it is more in their best interests.
Economic power in America is beginning to shift to Asian men, therefore political power will follow. After all, the 2nd most powerful state (some may argure the first) in the U.S. is 1/2 run by Asians. The Jewish run media feels threatened by competition in California (a precursor to what will happen in the rest of the country). Asians run things economically, and will challenge and win on the media battlefield (Hong Kong and the rest of Asia will eventually dominate).
Therefore when Asian influence surpasses Jewish influence in congress, Isreal will be a lame duck as America reduces its support.
To counter this, the Jews will try to attack their enemies by targeting the weak and easily influenced (Asian women and white youth).
When whites begin to imitate the "gangster rap" part of black culture, then it pretty much eliminates a good chunk of intellectual competition from whites.
By influencing Asian women to abandon their culture, the Jews are trying to hinder Asian America's further development and dominance. A highly educated Asian male defending/promoting his culture's interests will not be as effective as a couple with the same motives and interests.
Someone said somewhere else in this site about Sun Tzu's Art of War and attacking from within. That's exactly what the Jewish media is doing.
Some of you will surely think I am either crazy or anti-semetic. I am neither. If the Jewish community can further their interests with the above mentioned strategy, then why shouldn't they? I'm just pointing it out.
Conquer the weak and attack the strong who remain, that is what I think the cause of the gender divide is.
huu76
Sunday, March 03, 2002 at 05:32:44 (PST)
Max da cat:
"if you are hankering for a chick who comes from the same ethnic background as you, speaks the same language as you and has the same values as you.... go to asia....plenty of asian women there."
I'm an American citizen. The Chinese government would deny me citizenship if I tried to apply. The Malaysian government already denied me citizenship. Why and how should I go "back" to Asia just because of the type of women to whom I am attracted and expect to attract in return based on similarities in values, cultures, languages?
"if you want to live in a multicultural democracy stop whining about AF's."
If you wanna live in a multicultural democracy as opposed to a monocultural democracy, accept the fact that some people will want to marry within their own ethnicity and wish society and the media wouldn't grossly interfere with that desire. Whether marrying within your ethnicity actually works to preserve your culture in America is another story ...
T.H. Lien
Sunday, March 03, 2002 at 03:51:31 (PST)
Asian American Male:
As I recall, the honorable Mr. Romedios speaks Chinese, and most of the mixed-race people in Singapore are multigenerational mixed, no marrying-out issue, unlike here in U.S. where mixed-race kids tend to have two parents of different ethnicity.
We have the phenomenon here of worrying about the air quality in the kitchen while the house is burning down: AAs keep worrying their culture is gonna be lost because of people, mostly women, marrying out, and producing mixed-race offspring, but the fact is the culture is disappearing pretty fast among pure-race kids anyway. What is the point of marrying within your ethnicity? Either it is to more easily pass on your culture, language, and heritage to your kids. If it hasn't got that basis, then it is just some pointless exercise in racial segregation with a vague basis in "being more comfortable around your own people," and all the fretting we see here about outmarriage rate and the fact that you can't get with a hot Asian girl because of the media and societal influence, is just a fancy cover for a turf war over "our" women and a bunch of recriminations.
T.H. Lien. Parents of German, Scottish, Armenian, Malay, Filipino, and Chinese ancestry, proud to simply be Chinese.
Sunday, March 03, 2002 at 03:41:46 (PST)
Hello everyone...caucasian female here. I know that you may think I'm butting in where I don't belong, but before you assume that I don't know what I'm talking about, let me assure you that I'm talking about myself, and that I know very well. You've talked about stereotypes of Asian men as asexual beings hurting your chances, and I know the stereotypes you're talking about, and I haven't enough experience to comment on whether they're hurting you or not. But I can tell you about another stereotype: the one I personally grew up with. Stereotypes are never really good, but I hope that you can take this one as a refreshing change and a reminder that stereotypes are stereotypes, not the gospel, and not everyone buys into them. My stereotype of Asian men is loyal and honest, quiet and thoughtful. Self-controlled. Maybe not tall, but dark and handsome often enough. And with a touch of mystery to top it off. Like I said, it's just a stereotype--it's not reality. But I'm not the only one with these images in my mind, I know.
Ahankara
Saturday, March 02, 2002 at 21:40:43 (PST)
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