IS THE AA GENDER DIVIDE REAL?
(Updated )

sian American women are abandoning AA men by the millions. Young AA women seek out any race of men but their own. Women like Amy Tan write books and make movies that dump on AA men and glorify Asian women in relationships with white men.
     That's the perception of many AA men.
     On what do they blame this state of affairs? Brainwashing by media that play up white men while cutting Asian men off at the knees. Desire for payback by AA women who feel slighted by their families and Asian society. Large numbers of non-Asian men with blind fetishes for Asian women. Some even acknowledge that Asian men are often too fixed in their ideas of how a woman should look and behave, causing many AF to feel devalued.
     Other Asian Americans see AF outmarriage rates as merely a natural state of affairs for a 4% minority population that includes many recent immigrants. The outmarriage gender gap will narrow as growing Asian population centers provide ready access to bigger pools of singles. Besides outmarriage is't the same as rejecting one's racial identity, they argue. Many AF who outmarry retain strong identification with their Asian identity.
     Is there really an Asian American gender divide? Is so, what's behind it? If not, what's behind the perception?
"I'll give you another example: say you have black skin and you think it makes you ugly so you bleach your skin and do everything you can to make your skin fair. Are you going to find a person with dark skin attractive? I DON'T THINK SO."

Well not always. To give a stupid example, if you are a man, and start to get fat and look like you have breasts, you would do everything you could to get rid of them and achieve a flat chest, but regardless, still might not find a flat-chested women attractive. Some characteristics are considered attractive in one sex but not the other. Dark skin might be one. (Goldfish-like eyes probably aren't, but anyway ...).
T.H. Lien
   Friday, March 22, 2002 at 05:22:35 (PST)
In response to "be":

You said:
"I possess all the asian features, and yet I have been approached by many non-asian males. From my personal experiences, I feel it is the non-asian females who feel threaten in the presence of an AF b/c we draw more attention from guys...unintentionally and effortlessly."

My question is if you PERSONALLY feel that your asian features are less attractive than white features, not about how men perceive you.

I don't think non-asian (white) females are threatened in any way since they embody the american white beauty standard. I would say that asian females are stereotyped as exotic, subservient, sexual beings and so may be approached by men for that reason. Also, any half-way decent looking woman of ANY race has been approached by many men in her life, so it is not specific to asian women and it doesn't really tell us anything.
Matt Richardson
   Friday, March 22, 2002 at 02:52:48 (PST)
This is in response to "don't like labels but an AF nonetheless":

First of all, I find your attitude toward the "AF label" interesting-- why don't you like being called an asian female? Do you also not like being "labeled" as a female? If you don't mind this label, then why do you mind the asian one since those are your geographical and cultural roots? Do you ever see european-americans say they don't like the "european" label? No, but many asians (like yourself) seem to think it holds a negative connotation. Why is this?


You said:
"While there are predetermined factors that come into play when others (in this case, people of other race) meet you (in this case, AM) such as that persons past experiences with people of your race, you are still the most important contributing factor."

You are still the most important contributing factor, but it seems that, for many asian women, you are only considered as possible dating/marriage material if you are NOT asian. This is what we are discussing here, because so many asian women date white men exclusively (or white men make up a majority of the men they choose to date). You can get into personality and all the unique things that make up a person, but when you see such a clear trend of asian women outmarrying so much compared to women of other races, combined with the attitudes encountered by so many men, you will see that some asian women tend not to look at a man as marriage material unless he is white. How often do you see white women who behave this way (obviously for nonwhite men)? It is very rare.


You said: "There are many reasons as to why Asian females would like to date White males, not the least of these being money, status and power. From my own experience however, I observed the reasons that bring interracial couples together are: a need for companionship, shared likes/goals, and attraction. "

I think that intelligent discussion of the issues is a good thing. Many people are trying to stifle the discussion by saying things like:
1. It is too complex to even begin to discuss
2. There is too much negativity in the discussion and discussing it is not helpful or productive
3. It is personal preference
4. It is none of your business, why do you care?
5. Love is colorblind

I'm not arguing that relationships in general don't form based on companionship, shared likes/goals, and attraction. I am trying to form an intelligent discussion of the issue here, which I feel is important. The issue is this: 40% of asian women in the US marry outside their race, vs. only 5% of white women. More than 95% of the asian women who marry outside their race marry white men. Why do you think this is? You say some possible reasons are "money, status and power" but asians as a group are one of the most successful, wealthy, and well-educated groups in the country so what you say makes no sense since plenty of asian men (and women) have money, status, and power. The question is why do a disproportionately large percentage of asian women have the same "personal preference" which is white men? You claim that a discussion only provides an outlet for asian male insecurities and that nothing will come of it, but I think that if we get responses from the (many) asian women on this website and start an intelligent discussion, maybe we will come closer to an understanding of just what is going on here.

Matt Richardson
meme0114@yahoo.com    Friday, March 22, 2002 at 02:46:03 (PST)
This is in response to "be":

Regarding possible reasons why a disproportionately large percentage of asian women marry outside their race, you said:

"1) AF wants to free themselves of the pressure they endured growing up in a family that overstress achievements and incapable of expressing affections. "

Can you tell me how marrying a white man will free them of the pressures they endured growing up? Are you implying that they will face the same pressure from their husbands? This makes no sense to me, since american-born asian men are aplenty and they generally have a very westernized and liberal mindset. Are you talking about pressure from the asian man's parents? If so, this makes no sense either since you may face much worse pressure from many white men's parents who don't approve of their son marrying an asian girl. If you're going to tell me that not all white parents are this way, it is also true that not all asian parents put this type of pressure on their daughter in law. Please expand on this.

You said:
"2) AF may find WM more physically attractive b/c they are more likely to conform to the today’s standard of beauty."

This comes back to the whole self-hatred issue. When you say "today's standard of beauty", I assume you are referring to a beauty standard set by those in control of the American media- mostly white people. Since whites make up over 75% of the US population, it is no wonder they set the beauty standards. However, why is this not recognized as a WHITE beauty standard? As for the self-hate thing, say an asian woman doesn't find asian eyes attractive because they don't conform to the white beauty standard and she even considers cosmetic surgery to rid herself of this "ugly" feature. Isn't it logical to assume that she would not find this feature attractive in a man? And since this feature is common to almost all asians, isn't this an issue of racial self-hatred? Also, if you explain this by saying asian women prefer white men because of the beauty standard, then why don't you see an equal number of asian men marrying white women since they fit the white beauty standard better than asian women?

"4) AM takes dating more seriously, therefore they are not as aggressive."

This is stereotyping all asian males, saying they take dating more seriously. Again, are you including american-born asian men in this? If so, what you sya makes no sense since their values are generally just as americanized as the average american-born asian woman.

Matt Richardson
meme0114@yahoo.com    Friday, March 22, 2002 at 02:22:53 (PST)
"The purpose of my post was to examine the statistically-backed trend- as I said, 40% of asian women (on average) marry white men in the US."

Let's examine this issue then. Before I proceed, I must point out that..it may be true 40% of AF marry WM...but not all 40% of those AF were exclusively dating WM when they were single...and not all 40% were self-haters...and not all 40% despise AM. A small percentage do possess all these traits..and again, that hatred is based on ignorance.

Let's put the "sell-outs" aside, and discuss the issues with the majority of us AF...who do not display such extreme hatred against our own kind. After reading some of the AM comments on this forum about their involvement with AF..it sounds to me that AF suffering from insecurities is prevalent. Obviously, this is a very unattractive trait...and no one desires to be this way. But if we can at least understand the causes, perhaps the friction between AF and AM will not be as intense.

B/c I can only speak for myself..I will tell you the issues I had dealt with...and hopefully you guys would have a better understanding of AF (btw..AF, you need to speak out). Obviously, not all AF had the same issues I had...but there probaly are similiarities.

I grew up in a traditional asian family (with many siblings)...we were all taught to be unaffectionate, obediant, and hardworking (achievements werent desired, they were expected). However, the female roles included being subserviant (not just to our parents, but our bros), holding our tongue (our opinions somehow did not matter as much as the males), being dependant upon our family to make decisions for us (whether we liked it or not), and we were not allowed to go out (this was during high school) unless our brothers came along with us. I accepted this as the ways things were, although I felt worthless.

Around predominately non-asians environments, like school...life was the complete opposite. I was encouraged to speak up, ladies were always put first (unlike the asian culture), and individualism was desired. I yearned to be this way, but I didnt fit in.

In the media, I see the constant false portrayal of AF being sexual objects. It didnt bother me, until I started realizing alot of non asian males (who knew nothing about me) also saw me this way. It contributed to my already-confused self.

At work, bosses were eager to hand over complicated tasks...but they were never there to hear me out. It left me feeling used.

I read goldsea forum, and I see terms describing AF such as "self-haters", "sell-outs", "white-washed"...and although, I know I'm none of the above...but somehow it still hurts. Perhaps b/c I know those "self-haters" dealt with the same issues I had...but they remain too weak to realize their worth. More importantly than this, alot of AF who arent "sell-outs" still have to deal with this stigma, among the others.

Do you now understand why AF may suffer from insecurities? It sad that the gender continues to divide...I know AM have stigmas too. Bashing one another only fuels the flame. Maybe this is the time to speak out in a more constructive manner so the rest of us can be more understanding. Afterall, AF are not the only cause of the gender dividing or the increasing AF/WM relationships...nor are we the solution. Many complex factors have contributed to this problem...therefore, we must work together if we want to make progress.
be
   Friday, March 22, 2002 at 01:58:20 (PST)
Matt Richardson,

look who cares about stats and all that bulls*** so what if 40% of asian-american women will marry white men ..i couldn't care less if some stupid survey says 90% of AF only date whites
It's no big deal there's plenty of women of all race for everyone ..
Asian fly guy
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 22:19:04 (PST)
Matt Richardson,

"Why do so many asian women SHARE this EXACT "personal preference" for white men? Why do 40% of asian women marry outside their race, and why almost always only to white men? This versus only 5% of white women who marry outside their race."

Where the hell are you from buddy? Where I'm from the number of AF/WM relationships don't even come close to this. I seriously doubt the validity of this statistic. If what you say is true I'm sure you don't mind providing a credible source for your statement. I work in retail. I see asians such as myself everyday and by far the majority of asians are in AM/AF. Here is another shocker...I've noticed a lot more AM/WF relationships as well. It's gotten to the point where it's almost as common as AF/WM relationships.
whatever Matt
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 21:55:09 (PST)
"The WM/AF couples are no longer exceptions. Just look at the Mail Order Bride business. In Singapore white women detest "their" men dating local "girls" and they would not date any "inferior" local men."

hey Thai,

first off have u even been to singapore??? cuz i like to know where the hell u got that info from? i am a 25year old chinese from singapore and i can assure u that is complete bulls***! most white girls here have no problem with dating asian guys ..i met my wife who is white australian in a internet cafe 3 years ago and a few of my friends have white girlfriends so stop making stupid statements unless u have been here!
Singapore guy
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 21:30:54 (PST)
I live in the Dallas happily married to an AF. I hardley see AF/WM relationships. though my sons friends include two hapas. From my expirences with AF's I rarely have seen a WM. Thus it shocks me two hear that this is an issue with AM's. I feel that even so it does not matter wether inter-ratial relationships occur. For isn't it the idea that keeps our country America in harmony the idea that there is no sexism or racial profiling? So how is it wrong for a AF?WM to have a relationship?
Aveeno
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 19:46:35 (PST)
Asian American Male,

"I think that the Asian American men should look for brides back in Asia, .......the whites become a minority in this country"

You think whites will let themselves become the minority in this country? Wake up. Fight your battle here. Be proactive in asking non-asian women out.
FOP
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 18:09:35 (PST)
To AA Male Perspective,

Well said - INDEEEED!!!

Kudos!

Agreed 10000%!

You can be VIP in one of our BOOMIN' Party's.

-Clap!-Clap!-Clap!

BLACKTWINTURBO
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 18:07:37 (PST)
be,

normally i'd just snicker at your spoiled little girl shenanigans and then go on with more important stuff in life worthy of attention. but i'm feeling socialable right now and feel it just might help for the asian community to make some amends with some AF such as you, so let me remind of the old asian saying about how the wise admits they don't know enough and the fool thinks she knows everything. so how smart of you to note the "villageidiot" moniker. i didn't want to insult your "intelligence" in the previous posts about the banality of it, of course i call myself the villageidiot because I DO ADMIT that i don't know everything. the most endearing character about people from my perspective is the ability to be humble. i've taught myself this important lesson. however, like i suggested to you before, "be," go take a lesson in self-control. all you've done so far is to throw hissy-fits like the spoiled little girl you are whenver somebody disagrees with you.

have you noticed almost all the AM on this divide board disagrees with your views thus far? i'm not here to dismiss your perspectives and experiences, but all you've done to provide a bubble for yourself inside which no bigotry or injustice exists. and whenever somebody tries to state THEIR OWN experiences about the real world all you've done is to dismiss them and call them racist. yes, you did say how we AM are racist against AF, among other things. i've even gone far as to read some of your earlier posts from late february and early march, and no doubt if anybody else goes back will notice how you, "be," calls people narrow-minded, fools, idiots, and racists (etc) for having different opinions from you. i personally don't care about it anymore, i've had my share and name-calling loses its meaning for me.

but in my previous post i pointed out that "be" used the term "SON" to refer to some AM who wanted to have a discussion. i don't know any girl who calls somebody, who might be her senior in years, "son." in fact, the most insulting thing about this term is how closely it resembles the old segregation days when whites used to call grown black men "boys" to denigrate them. only because of this i felt compelled to point out the subtle inneundos "be" was using in her attacks.

anyhow this serves no purpose other than to create more friction. but i just want AF like "be" to note that we AM are not all full of hatred for AF/WM couples, i myself just wish they keep it honest and say "hey there is this trend with AF/WM and there is something here more than just meets the eye than just personal preference." i really hate the "phonies" who say everything is fine-n-dandy when in fact the experiences of we AM say to the contrary. it's not what people say, but what they do.

anyhow i'm writing this in good faith that i might make amends because i had a really good talk with somebody from the middle east today about forgiveness with all the madness going on there. now let's see how does "be" respond.

and i think "be" this serves no more purpose but to clog the server, so email me if you've got further gripe with me. note that i didn't put you down in this post, i'm merely fed up with your attitude -- which i hope in real life you don't act like the hissy-fit little girl you've been demonstrating in here for your sakes.
villageidiot
villageidiot1@collegeclub.com    Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 17:06:41 (PST)
This is my two cents.I am a Korean Anmerican Male that lives in NYC. I notice that when it comes to inter-racial marriage you could break it down with in asian groups. Mostly Japanese,Flipino, and other South east asian marry outside the race. This is for both men,and women. Chinese and Koreans also have a share of inter-racial marriage but not as high as the other groups. I personal think it has to do with the availability. There is just a higher number of KOrean men, and Chinese men. Yes, there are asian women who only date outside the race but , I have seen asian men do this to. Matt Richardson does make some good points. Even in my personal experience I have met asian women who has a mountain of a chip in their shoulder and feels as if asian men are just dog meat. It kind of reminds me of the angry Black man syndrome. (you know blame everything on the white man)
I think if there has to be a solution asian men has to win the asian women back. One way of doing this is by not living up to the stereotype that an asian women might have of an asian men.Asian men has to be a better person. We got to be more romantic and have all our act together. The media has to protray asian men in more of a equal and fair light. Asian guys have to change how asian women look at us. And if we did our part and still asian women deny us. Then shame on asian women for not seeing the goodness within asian men.
john
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 14:51:33 (PST)
I think that AF's should give AM's a chance here. At least give him the chances to get to know you better. Just like the line from their song "Got the Time" from a heavy metal band which goes, "Wake up, got another day to get, through now, got another man to see, gotta call him on the telephone ay-o, gotta find piece of paper, sit down, got another letter to write, think hard, gotta get a letter just right, little ringing on the telephone oh no,
gotta write another letter." Something like that. I'm a true AF lover, especially Chinese women.
chineselova
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 14:09:06 (PST)
"Why do 40% of asian women marry outside their race,"...

Open minded? No. Most Asian groups are prejudiced against each other..thus for a Chinese family a daughter marrying a Vietnamese may be, well, despicable, while marrying whites would be more acceptable. Thus, you marry Chinese, failing which you marry white.

and why almost always only to white men?

Narrow minded? Yes. Wish they would marry black and hispanic men, and would be more open to Asian men of different ethnicities.

This versus only 5% of white women who marry outside their race.

Prejudiced, bigoted and narrow minded? Not accepted in society? Do not want to give up privilegs that the world bestows
upon them?

Sociologist
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 13:24:45 (PST)
"Why do 40% of asian women marry outside their race, and why almost always only to white men? This versus only 5% of white women who marry outside their race."

Both numbers seem rather extreme. But, the answer could be this. 4% of the white male population marry 40% of the Asian female population. In absolute numbers 4% of the white male population is equivalent to 40% of the Asian female population. 5% of the white women population marry mostly blacks or more likely mostly white Hispanics who were originally from countries such as Brazil, Argentina, Uruguay and Chile. These generally look white and are used as a ploy to deny employment to dark skinned minorities in a number of places. You hire "hispanics" you generally satisfy the quota and you do not have to hire blacks or Asians.

40% of Asian men find it hard to get dates...but one can also ask the question as to why white women will not date Asian men rather than why Asian women will date only white men. The answer to me seems obvious. White men are more secure..while white women are not, or perhaps white women are more prejudiced and conformist compared to white men.
Census
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 13:20:11 (PST)
be,

Sorry, I should have put an annotation there to indicate it was a sarcastic rhetorical question.

When you see the new update, try to tackle the questions I have for you, especially the first one.

I don't do pot. Pot is for trailer trash. Maybe you should call yourself wannabe, instead of be.

FOP (A HK Born Chinese)
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 13:06:55 (PST)
Sad truth about being AA especially female:

It's quite sad when with all the achievements and grandeur of the Asian race in the world, that the worst enemy to the AA male figure is the lowly sellout AA female.

Soooo Sad. I wish AA women would look up to black and hispanic women instead worshipping the white women, who only laugh at them. No one respects those who abandon themselves.
Enough Said
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 13:02:15 (PST)
This is in response to "AC Dropout":

You said:
"A-man,
Don't be too hard on Matt...."

To what post are you referring? I see no posts from Asian men so far that are hard on me, or even that disagree with me. Please let me know.
Matt Richardson
meme0114@yahoo.com    Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 12:41:04 (PST)
I am aware that there are AF 'sell-outs'. Like I said before, their actions are based on ignorance and yes, insecurities too...and I do not fully understand them, either...therefore, I can not speak for them. My comments are based from my personal expereinces and observations as an AF who is open in dating (more specificially, any ethnicity). I am hoping my perspective can help you guys understand us AF more.

huu76:
I really enjoyed reading your insights on AF. You must be a genius..to not be an AF, yet know more than us about the reasons for our actions. Why bother responding to your questions, when you already fixated on your theories and AF bashings.

hah:
I said earlier..."From my personal experiences, I feel it is the non-asian females who feel threaten in the presence of an AF b/c we draw more attention from guys...unintentionally and effortlessly."
You said..."Speaking as a white girl, I have never come across this phenomenon..."

B/c you are a white girl, I would imagine that are are capable of understanding English. However, you have proved otherwise. I dont expect everyone to agree with me, that's why I said..."from personal expereince"...and I also said "I'm eager to hear other AF response on this topic." Is this so difficult for you to understand?

Village Idoit:
Once an idoit, always an idoit. Sad i have to keep replying to your messages this way.

I said.."1) AF wants to free themselves of the pressure they endured growing up"
You replied.."so how are we AM any different?"
AM are raised in a similar environment as an AF. However, AF play the subservient role..and are not regarded as highly as AM in the same family.

I said..."4) AM takes dating more seriously, therefore they are not as aggressive."
You replied..."OMG! what kind of twisted logic is this?"
My only reply to your stupidity is this..Do AM takes dating more seriously than WM? Are AM not as agressive as WM?

I said..."2) AF may find WM more physically attractive...3)...the media's sexual portrayal of AF.
YOu replied..."i suggest a quick look at the word "shallow" and a tool of the media before going any further with this analysis"
The key word on #2 was..'may'...and the reason is b/c of the white standard of beauty. #3..the media's FALSE sexual portrayal of AF DO impact WM perception of AF. Of course, I dont expect you to acknowledge this...after all, you're just an AF basher.

FOP:
"in order to conform to the standard of beauty which happens to be "white" as you pointed out, one needs to look "less asian"."
You're right. You cant look asian and white simultaneously. My point was that AF who had have plastic surgery (the ones I know, at least) are NOT doing it b/c they want to look less asian or look more white. They simply want to look more beautiful..and it just so happens that today's society define beauty as 'white'. I think most of us would agree that natural beauty is preferable...but I just want you all to understand the reasons are not based on hate.

"Some white families also overstress achievements & incapable of expressing affections as well."
You're out of touch with your ethnicity. More percentage of asian families are that way than white families.

"Serious, but not aggressive. What a oxymoron!"
AM takes dating more seriously...which means they do not date as many girls as WM. B/c of this..and the reserved asian culture, they are not as agressive.

"Don't you think it would make AF less physically attractive b/c, as you said, today's standard of beauty is white, not asian."
Yes, some AF feel they do not conform to today's standard of beauty. The media's false sexual portrayal of AF catches many guys attention. They approach AF with this mindset...and initially it boosts the AF self-esteem when guys flirt. However, when the truth is discovered...it becomes a huge insult for AF.

Matt:
"So you are telling me that asians who get this surgery are not trying to look "less asian" even though they ARE trying to conform to a white beauty standard?"
Yes, this does sound contradictory IF the issue is about race...but its not. As I have mentioned earlier to FOP, this is about about conforming to a standard of beauty. B/c beauty is 'white'...you think this is what we want to be...but that's hardly the case.

"Would an Asian woman find her daughter (with a white man) less attractive if the child inherited more of her asian features? Would an asian woman think of her child (with a white man) as less attractive than if the mother had been white?"
This is a subjective question...therefore, I can only give you my opinion. I find bi-racial children in general to be beautiful...yes, even more beautiful than a pure breed white or asian. I think they possess a unique look...and that to me is beauty...contrary to today's standard of beauty.

"I find it interesting that, whenever these issues are brought up, someone invariably attempts to stifle the discussion by saying "why are we being so negative? why not focus on the positives?...The purpose of my post was to examine the statistically-backed trend""
You're correct. We should examine this issue CAREFULLY. I agree the alarming rate in AF/WM relationships is a huge problem. However, its unfair for you all to accuse AF of 'self-hatred' without hearing us out. I admit, AF do have security problems (we all do to some degree)...but it is not based on hatred. I am trying my best to explain from an AF perspective...but it seems like most people on this forum want to dismiss AF opinions. It makes me wonder about the reason for all the AF bashings (this is directed to all the guys on this forum)...is bashing AF an entertaining way of releasing anger? or do you want to help dissolve this problem? If the latter is your goal, then please...hear us out.

I have more to say..but I must go. later...
be
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 12:39:25 (PST)
I just want to say that there are alot of interesting points here in this discussion. I do want to bring up something that correlates with this. That is the fact that our little boy is half-asian-half/white, and my husband's family talk about how he inherited my husbands "Asian nose" and constantly pinch it , believing that, according to them,it will make it a "more white looking feature".
They do continually speak about how glad they are he has inherited my eyes, since my husband has "small Asian eyes". They actually said to me "He has good eyes, not small Asian eyes, but his nose is not good because he has an Asian nose."
Now that upset me in the fact that I had to remind them to please "do not pinch my son's nose in the false belief that it will change his ethniticity of it, That he is part Asian and therefore he should look Asian !"
This opinion is not only within the particular family, but also has come from strangers in shopping areas, restaurants, and Asian friends, and advice from a Filipino friend of mine who is in her 40's. Most have commented on the fact that he did not inherit the "small Asian eyes"
My husband is Asian, he looks like an Asian man with Asian features and I love him just the way he is.
Any insights into this? Please be sincere as I am truly wanting to learn. Is this all about "white" and western culture being a popular standard for beauty?
Hannybunbun
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 11:08:02 (PST)
Matt Richardson, you ask:

"Especially considering that most of these asian women have closer cultural
ties with asian men, many if not most grew up around other asian families in their neighborhood, why do you see this behavior among asian women and not white women?"

"Why do 40% of asian women marry outside their race, and why almost always only to white men? This versus only 5% of white women who marry outside their race."

I will now ask the same question of another group, Lebanese American females, which no one ever asks: "Especially considering that most of these Lebanese women have closer cultural ties with Lebanese men, many if not most grew up around other Arab families (eg. Lawrence, MA, Peoria, IL or Dearborn, MI) in their neighborhood, why do you see this behavior among Lebanese women and not white women? Why do 40% of Lebanese women marry outside their race (Arab), and why almost always only to white men? This versus only 5% of white women who marry outside their race."

Is it because the Lebanese women are considered white, that their culture does not matter....both Asian American and Lebanese American women have cultures different from whites...yet no one questions Lebanese American women marrying white American men or for that matter vice versa. A number of politicians in the US are products of such marriages including John Sununu of New Hampshire, Darrel Issa of California, Matt Rahall of West Virginia and Chris John of Louisiana. Why is this question never asked? It has nothing to do with culture but everything to do with the American obsession with skin color and race...Lebanese women look white!
Asian Male
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 10:58:09 (PST)
Some of these accusation of asian wanting to be white is getting somewhat out of hand in my opinion.

Asian Female in asia obsess over being young and and beautiful. In asia a women is basically over the hill by 25. Their obsession with being thin around the legs and arms, dying hair, eye surgury, not developing a tan, or over tanning has nothing to do with a wanting to be white. It about getting the most attention.

These women are looking to be married at a young age, because asia is still very much a male dominant society and the average women are still very much dependent on men for social status.

The trend in asia is to most fashionable, not the most white.

Now if some of the AA population are influenced by trends which occur abroad. I don't know if one could qualify it as they are influence by wanting to be white. Or wanting to be fashionable by Asian standards in Asia.

Perhaps in Matt's experience he had the opportunity to date a select popuation of low esteem AF who felt more confident having eye surgury. Perhaps he has the personality type attractive these type of AF.

But I really think it is the inexperience of posters on the board in Asia to assume these trends were developed to be more white.

Only in American will a minority groups action be placed on the back drop of black and white, even if it has nothing to do with race.
AC Dropout
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 10:42:46 (PST)
Matt you say that "why do you see this behavior among asian women and not white women?"

Perhaps white women are more close minded and racist?

Indo
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 09:05:49 (PST)
AAM.
"that would quicken the day when the whites become a minority in this country"
Doesn't matter, Asians will still be a minority compared to Hispanics. $800 plane ticket vs. catching a ride across the border. Or 3 months at sea + beatings by snakeheads vs. 48 hours in an underground tunnel.

"Asian American men should look for brides back in Asia"
Unworkable.

1) This generally requires cultural/linguistic functionality in some Asian country. Most Asian-American men could only chase that small subset of Asian women who speak English.

2) You need money for plane tickets to Asia, long-distance phone bills, and, eventually if it gets that far, immigration lawyers, etc. Poor Asians get screwed.

3) There is already a shortage of women in Mainland China greater than the entire ethnic Asian population of the USA. Even in the unlikely event many AAM are successful in finding mates in Asia, we end up simply transferring the problem to our brothers in the homeland, and transforming this into a "natives vs. overseas Asians and whites who steal local women" problem.

T.H. Lien
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 09:05:00 (PST)
"It is obviously an issue of color and race, or else you'd see far more IR couples with asian women and non-white, non-asian men as well. How is it that you don't see this as a problem?"

Why aren't you asking the same question to white females? The question should be why aren't more white females wanting or willing to marry outside their race in this most advanced countries of the world?

Asian Female
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 09:03:45 (PST)
Matt Richardson:

"Why do 40% of asian women marry outside their race, and why almost always only to white men?"

The situation is similar to the Lebanese women here in Louisiana. Early in the twentieth century, there were a large number of settlers from Lebanon here in Baton Rouge. White looking Lebanese women with a southern accent almost never dated Lebanese men, forcing the latter to look towards the middle east for brides. In fact, Lebanese women wanted to be white. They so desparately wanted to be accepted as white that they even attended lynching parties. "Fortunately" for the Lebanese women and girls in Jim Crow Louisiana, most of them did look white, and they could deny their heritage. Most Lebanese women were white wannabes and they are given that privliege by the white society due to their sharp white features. The same can be said about white Hispanic women, other white looking Arabic women and Turkish women. Unfortunately for the AA women, they can never look white- their eyes, nose and in most cases darker skin color would always mark them as not white and hence no privlege would be afforded them. They can try everything, but they would never be white!

"This versus only 5% of white women who marry outside their race."

Does racism among white American females sound familiar to you? Why would they want to give up their privilege? Would you if you were in their position? They see Lebanese women want to be white and everyone else want to be white and everyone tells you white is right...why would you want to marry "down" to an Asian, and your "tainted" daughters wont have the same privilege as you once did? Here in the south black people have been lynched over the past centuries because white women simply screamed..."eech! a black is looking at me or touched me." People suspect that a lynching happened in a small town of Kokomo, Louisiana two years ago over this very issue! Just think about it.
Cajun-Lebanese/black/asian mix
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 08:52:51 (PST)
40% of Asians girls in the U.S.A should learn from the Hispanic girls. They definitely have racial pride. That is why they are becoming the fastest minority group in the U.S, dont you agree? Power will come in numbers for them. It's only a matter of time until they become the majority.Why are Asians still just a small percentage of the U.s Population? We will never get equal representation if we stay like that.
Concerned AM
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 08:35:28 (PST)
AA Male:
Good points.

Don't like lables:
So, IR is caused by AF looking for companionship and common interests etc.

I guess being a "White girl" and all, she can only find these traits in one of her fellow WM right? We AM wouldn't know companionship if it bit us in the ass huh?

Be...again:

I do blame the Jews for many problems facing N. America internationally. Read some of the other forums.

Do you think the media considered it a bonus when they found out how easy AF are to brainwash (to further their own goals of continued dominance of congress by keeping AM out).

To all...

Love is colourblind, personal preference, you're ignorant, blah blah blah...

These are just convenient excuses when AF are seen for what they really are, self hating white girl worshippers.

P.S. I don't see AF/WF frienships very often in Toronto. Usually the WF hangs out with her kind or other groups like Italians, blacks (but not AF). You think maybe it's because she knows AF will always be trying to steal her boyfriend?
huu76
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 08:27:25 (PST)
Munchies,

All you trying the insinuate that the asian population might exhibit more that one type to "normal mode," dependent on lateral and vertical forces exhibited by society.

That AM could be either a WIMP or a MACHO.

Theorectical physics joke.

What did the drowning theorectical physicist say?
- log log log log log..... hahahaha

AC Dropout
   Thursday, March 21, 2002 at 08:02:18 (PST)

NEWEST COMMENTS | EARLIER COMMENTS