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ASIAMS.NET |
ASIAN AMERICAN ISSUES
IS THE AA GENDER DIVIDE REAL?
(Updated
Tuesday, Apr 1, 2008, 06:05:50 PM)
sian American women are abandoning AA men by the millions. Young AA women seek out any race of men but their own. Women like Amy Tan write books and make movies that dump on AA men and glorify Asian women in relationships with white men.
That's the perception of many AA men.
On what do they blame this state of affairs? Brainwashing by media that play up white men while cutting Asian men off at the knees. Desire for payback by AA women who feel slighted by their families and Asian society. Large numbers of non-Asian men with blind fetishes for Asian women. Some even acknowledge that Asian men are often too fixed in their ideas of how a woman should look and behave, causing many AF to feel devalued.
Other Asian Americans see AF outmarriage rates as merely a natural state of affairs for a 4% minority population that includes many recent immigrants. The outmarriage gender gap will narrow as growing Asian population centers provide ready access to bigger pools of singles. Besides outmarriage isn't the same as rejecting one's racial identity, they argue. Many AF who outmarry retain strong identification with their Asian identity.
Is there really an Asian American gender divide? Is so, what's behind it? If not, what's behind the perception?
This interactive article is closed to new input.
Discussions posted during the past year remain available for browsing.
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WHAT YOU SAY
[This page is closed to new input. --Ed.]
Political Observer:
Thanks guy. I'm a one-man show so it's nice to get some support from time to time. I support Asian openness, but at times it's certainly trying. Appreciate your objectiveness and poetic parity (think I just coined a new phrase, if anyone wants to use it).
Geoff DB
GeoffDB02@aol.com
Saturday, September 07, 2002 at 12:38:43 (PDT)
[172.192.38.16]
Handsome Playboy:
"And btw, I AM a very handsome guy. What do you want me to do? Lay off the Hatorade, guy."
Nothing that I said in my initial post to you was intended to detract from your physical attractiveness. While I normally maintain a physical distance from Asian guys, because I realize the consequences of reaching out, I still respect and admire you from a distance.
I've never said anything about hating you or any Asian guy. In fact, it's cool to see Asian guys get play with beautiful women of all races. Asian guys are marginalized in America. Particularly, it's nice to see good-looking Asian guys out with beautiful black women.
I saw a handsome Asian guy with a beautiful black woman the other day at a video store and thought good for them.
A white friend of mine, who has a very attractive girlfriend of Russian descent, could easily pose for any magazine or be a runway model. He and I were walking down the street and all eyes were on us. White, Asian and black women and men were literally staring him down. In spite of all this obvious admiration going on, he never divided his attention between what I was saying and how they were looking at him. I only noticed their admiration because I was doing most of the talking for a while. He doesn't let his good looks go to his head and he doesn't advertise his good looks. If you KNOW you're good looking it WILL go to your head and it WILL turn women off.
All I was saying is when you're a handsome guy women will respect you and even entreat you as long as you are down to earth. Some will even offer to buy you a drink.
BTW, I don't hate the player; only the game.
Geoff DB
GeoffDB02@aol.com
Saturday, September 07, 2002 at 12:34:15 (PDT)
[172.192.38.16]
I was shopping for DVDs the other day, and this AF start to kiss her WM in front of me. It was gross. She is not pretty to start with, and he is the usual dorky bloke who dates AF because most WF won't go near him. To all the AM here who wants to date WF, I say go for it. Who wants to date Lucy Liu if you can date Nicole Kidman? Or Zhang Ziyi? Notice even these famous AF are not having much success with dating other famous WM? That's because there are so many gorgeous famous WF around. If I were AM, I will not be on this board being bitter and complaining about selfout AF only dating WM. I will go out and find myself a gorgeous WF and kiss her in a DVD store.
Justagirl
Saturday, September 07, 2002 at 02:15:58 (PDT)
[203.103.156.158]
Korean Boy,
They do what everyone else does everwhere else. They import Asias #1 export (women).
Repost,
Yeah, I find AF's attractive, it doesn't mean I'll date one. Someday a perfect one might be born, but then again, monkeys might come flying out of my butt too.
Handsome One,
So you like the leftovers that the bad boys leave behind huh? That's the problem with womeon nowadays. After they grow up and realize it's better to be with someone who can take care of them (just in case), they've become too old to compete against the younger ones who don't feel the need to be with the bad boys.
Most AM may not be bad boys, but they sure look a lot more attractive 5-10 years down the road.
huu76
Friday, September 06, 2002 at 18:05:42 (PDT)
[64.231.96.20]
NYC AM,
That's alright. I'm an AM, and I never gave a damn about WF's. That's all.
dsfbcbsijbdax
Friday, September 06, 2002 at 17:40:33 (PDT)
[148.4.22.148]
AC Dropout wrote:
"All asain activitist groups in the USA are aware of the non-participation of asians in the census. Just quick web search of "census" "asian" "2000" and you will see the publication which my claims are based on."
I did a quick search and no such publication came up. Why don't you make it easy and tell us which website you got this 25% number?
"It's an arbitary assumption. That why it is a qualified statement "upto 25%.""
But wait, you said earlier your claims were based on some publication. But now you admit the 25% number is made up arbitrarily from the thin air? So you could have as easily said up to 2% or up to 80% right? Heck, since the number was arbitrary anyway, why not use the 80% number? It sounds a whole lot better than 25%.
Deng Ai
Friday, September 06, 2002 at 14:14:06 (PDT)
[198.6.73.7]
Geoff DB,
I'm guessing you'r a black dude. Are you? I have no problems whatsoever when I see a black guy with an Asian girl, as long as they don't have that hair-on-fire, I'm-a-rebel-so-f***-you- and-btw-I'm-f***ing-your-sister look that so many black men have when they are with trophy white women. I'm met some arrogant black pricks (not to mention white ones), but I actually would prefer to see AFs with BMs over WMs. I think the chill, respectful black dudes are a fantastic bunch. As long as you guys aren't arrogant and are respectful of other people's feelings, I'm cool. When I was younger I got such a kick out of parading my white trophies in front of AFs and WMs, but I have since grown up a great deal. I don't think any man should keep their women just as trophies. That is wrong and sad?
It's all good.
Friday, September 06, 2002 at 14:08:42 (PDT)
[128.253.186.46]
Rare stuff wrote:
"-not a standard, just a fashion."
The Saudis are probably the least fashionable people in the world. It's funny how the least fashion insensitive folks are now suddenly fashionable when it comes to picking out beautiful women.
"Not to mention some really weird fashion of primitive stoneage peoples in the rainforests, from deformed skull to blackened teeth and elongated necks, or the crippled feet which were once a Chinese fashion."
Blonde hair maybe fashionable, but for some reason when they asked for young blondes I don't think they had Asian, Middle Eastern, or black women with blonde hair in mind.
"Common people still like their own race best. Those sticking to fashions are just snobs or wannabe-snobs."
Just like common people like economy cars better because most common people drive economy cars?
Deng Ai
Friday, September 06, 2002 at 12:17:36 (PDT)
[198.6.73.7]
Fool wrote:
"As you're a self-professed ugly man who has never approached Asian girls, any points you've made about them have thereby become null and void."
Yes, you are free to ignore rantings from an ugly man who has never approached Asian girls. So, does this mean you will no longer follow me around?
Deng Ai
Friday, September 06, 2002 at 12:05:45 (PDT)
[198.6.73.7]
Repost,
Whether AMs or AFs are physically attracted to each other or not is not my point. I am sure you can find a good looking unattractive due to his/her other attributes. My point is there is a AA gender divide, which AC Dropout says is a myth.
Deng Ai
Friday, September 06, 2002 at 12:02:07 (PDT)
[198.6.73.7]
Geoff DB
you wrote
"Some white people are very honored to have so many Asians running out of breath chasing them."
Man you'd be surprised to know how much of those guys date AF cause they're insecure, have to dominate and are desperate for someone to attach to.
I'm not kidding you.
Same thing with AM gay guys. I'm straight but I have several friends here in san francisco who are gay. A gay friend of mine is actually into black men. Black guys who he date treat him like a regular guy. The asian guys treat him like a king so from time to time he will go to a popular gay asian club here for them to roll out the red carpet.
At first I didn't believe him. I thought he was putting up a front or something, so one night I went with him to the club. It was jam packed with guys waiting to smile in his face. After watching those clowns perform that night I walked away with zero respect for most of them.
So you see, there are cool white guys who are not your enemies. I'm sure not all asian guys are against you either.
Political Observer
Friday, September 06, 2002 at 11:17:39 (PDT)
[167.230.38.7]
GeoffDB/Political Observer,
Its' not racist at the core. I did know many Asian women that would run away black men like they are plague, but throw themselves at the arms of white men at any moment. They even think they were white and being with white men is natural to them. These are the individuals that I wanted point out, not BMs wanting to be with Asian women. Are they racist or me? You make the call.
Don't be slagging off Asian guys' chasing white women all over so early. BMs (OK, maybe not you but there are many others out there) are just the same even though they fervently deny their jungle fever and put on that sisters-are-the-mothers-of-earth attitude. They want to be with white women in secret. Malcom X even revealed in his autobiography that "black men would run over sisters to chase white women".
FOP
Friday, September 06, 2002 at 10:26:17 (PDT)
[24.93.48.161]
Korean boy,
Many are single. And the ones that find someone hold on to that person so hard that they are willing to do anything. It is sad but that is what happens.
By the way, if everything is equal between and AM and WM, many AF would choose the WM. In fact only if the AM is overwhelmingly superior to the WM will many AF even consider the AM. Many AF just want something white, anything white.
AA Athl
Friday, September 06, 2002 at 10:05:56 (PDT)
[165.123.243.13]
Dengi Ai,
you wrote
"Or do you mean the mere act of disagreement is a "cheap shot"?"
Basically what it boils down to is you don't merely ask tough questions, you try to humiliate.
Hank Lewis is married to an asian woman yet he doesn't pretend like he owns the world or has gotten over on asian guys. He's the type of guy who you should not try to agitate or humiliate.
you wrote "Have I taken cheap shots at you before? "
You and I got into it several weeks ago in the section titled white perception of AA. Remember that? You made some insensitive remarks that I thought were embarrassing to read. I'm not going to rehash old stuff, but we have a tad bit of bad history that's all. We got off on the wrong foot.
Political Observer
Friday, September 06, 2002 at 09:45:43 (PDT)
[167.230.38.7]
Korean boy,
It's my feeling that asian guys are getting a raw deal in america.
you wrote "If so many asian women date/marry outside the race in San Fransico. Where do the asian men go?"
Well it's like this, if asian women date white guys in large numbers it does leave a lot of asian guys looking for women of other races or settling for less attractive asian women or staying at home and mingling with friends. That's not fair.
you wrote "Do they just accept being single ?"
some of them probably do. asian men love asian women. If they don't get the asian woman they want many of them probably stay single for quite a long time :(
you wrote "Or do they somehow manage to find someone?"
sports, company parties and social gatherings are probably used to fill the void. I do notice more asian guys dating white women though. You have to learn to make adjustments and not get used to the victim role.
Political Observer
Friday, September 06, 2002 at 09:38:24 (PDT)
[167.230.38.7]
GeoffDB:
At the risk of throwing Everclear on a fire, here's my observations about AF/BM couples which I have seen in Houston, Vancouver, Seattle and San Diego:
They tend to be one of two extremes:
1. The BM is educated, articulate, professional, a sharp dresser and someone who has friends of all ethnicities. The AF is rather liberal and American acculterated but still has strong pride in her heritage and won't take crap from anyone of any race. In this case both of these individuals are above average in attractiveness and intelligence. Wayne Brady and his wife come to mind here.
2. The BM is very thuggy, a playa/pimp wannabe who thinks he's da man because he snagged an Asian chick. The AF is very Fobby and clueless, acts like a teenager with a chip on her shoulder trying to shock people and/or is sometimes a little... on the large side. In this case, these individuals are often not that attractive.
I'd say that case 1 is more common than case 2 in my observation. I know several women and men who are the products of relationships like #1 and they are some of the most interesting people I've ever met. They offer a perspective and a rich heritage from both sides of their families that is not all that common and typically are successful people.
In general when it comes to transethnic couplings of any ethnic mix, it tends to be really great or really lousy and not much in-between. I don't really know why that's the case, but that's just what I've observed anyway.
Hank Lewis
Friday, September 06, 2002 at 09:16:54 (PDT)
[161.159.4.35]
Cantreallyrelate:
I say ethnicity because there is only one race of homo sapiens on the planet--the Human race. Asians aren't neanderthals and Caucasians aren't cromagnons. We are all homo sapiens, which makes us the same "race."
Yeah, there are obviously physiological and cultural differences between ethnicities, just like a poodle is different from a boxer. However, poodles and boxers are still the same genus and species of canine, just like we're the same genus and species of primates. That's why I don't say "race" because it's really not an appropriate term.
Deng Ai:
I never said Whites were superior to Asians in certain categories. You said it. I don't happen to agree with it. If you're going to have to make me split hairs and say if you have a Caucasian American and an Asian American who were both born in San Diego, grew up in the same neighborhood, are the same height and weight, go to the same college and major in the same thing, work for the same company, etc. to make everything down to the last nit-picky thing exactly alike save for that one is Asian and one is White, you're being ridiculous.
In an Asian woman's eyes, there could easily conceivably be a White guy and an Asian guy who are exact equals in all the categories that matter with the only major difference that she would put her finger on be that one is Asian and one is White. I could still say "all else equal other than ethnicity" and it would be appropriate. You're debating semantics down to a ridiculous level on things which do not matter. You're just arguing for the sake of arguing and not really making a point.
The bottom line is that in the scenario described above, most Asian women would choose the Asian guy over the White guy. This bears out in the fact that there are more Asian/Asian couples than there are Asian/White couples. Yeah, the most common transethnic relationship is WM/AF, with the second most common being BM/WF. However, when compared to monoethnic couples, they are still by far the minority.
Hank Lewis
Friday, September 06, 2002 at 09:09:17 (PDT)
[161.159.4.35]
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