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GOLDSEA |
ASIAMS.NET |
ASIAN AMERICAN ISSUES
ARE IVY DEGREES WORTH THE SACRIFICES
ending their kids to ivy league universities is the dream of every Asian American parent. Or so it seems. And there is no shortage of young AA willing to oblige. As of 2000, Asian Americans made up 12-19% of the undergrad enrollments of the top-20 ivies.
No one questions the prestige associated with ivy degrees. In fact, sneer critics, that's the only thing bought with the extra money. And even that, they add, is wearing thin in a nation in which he cultural center of gravity has shifted to California.
It's true that investments in high ivy tuitions often don't show up in career earnings when compared with graduates of public universities of comparable student body profiles. But the criticisms run deeper than return on investment. Some Asian Americans who have attended ivy league colleges have come away regretting their decisions for other reasons.
Foremost is the sense that the ivies are structured for the benefit of legatees, the progeny of blueblooded alumni. Comprising upwards of 40% of some ivies, the legatees are often exempted from stringent admissions standards. The result is that AA students with excellent credentials are the workhorses preserving the institutions' high academic reputations, thereby giving a free ride to undeserving legatees.
Another common complaint is that the deck is stacked socially against Asian males in a system designed to preserve the princely status quo of the scions of WASP families. A disproportionate number of attractive AA females are admitted by the ivies, some have observed, while far fewer attractive AA males are admitted. This subtle bias, suspect critics, is implemented in the screening interviews used by most ivies.
Then there's the Eurocentric worldview imposed by the courses. Not to mention the lousy weather, bland food and having to put up with locals hostile toward Asians. Contrast all this against the majority-ease lifestyles enjoyed by the AA in, say, the UC campuses.
The bragging rights an ivy education affords parents, conclude critics, are far outweighed by the psychic and emotional sacrifices exacted from their kids.
Does an ivy education provide rewards commensurate with the sacrifices? Or is it a trap for AA with overzealous parents with old-world views?
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WHAT YOU SAY
[This page is closed to new input. --Ed.]
(Updated
Tuesday, Apr 1, 2008, 06:01:11 PM)
hs am:
First, most everyone here has been through the college admissions process, so that's not a sign of special expertise.
I never even mentioned asian vs. white test scores. I pointed out that I have no idea what redeeming qualities a guy with a 1600 SAT has, since the test is a joke compared to public exams Asia, but the fact remains the SAT pretty accurately predicts academic rank in college. (However, most universities still like to think of themselves as training grounds for scholars rather than pre-professional schools, which is presumably one justification for looking for other qualities). APs are even worse, you can get top marks with like 60% of the test right. I passed the European History exam and received college credit after scoring my worst grades in my entire high school career in the course.
And as for prep vs. public: You mention the absolute top band of public schools in America, but even still, for whatever reason, the percentage of the graduating class sent to ivy leagues is higher among the prep schools. When I attended, my school sent an average of 30 kids a year to Harvard alone from a graduating class of around 330. The atmosphere was ridiculously competitive while still being mostly honest. I never heard of people stealing each other's notes or so much other nonsense to sabatoge each other. What I did see was people sitting in the library until closing time every night, including Fridays and Saturdays, while still finding time to play sports (required every term, unless you were in community service or theater, which would give you a pass from sports), without being called nerds or feeling they were losing out socially, because EVERYONE around them was doing the same thing. I remember the illegal smoking breaks me and my dormmates took on the roof at 4 AM, looking around at the other dorms, and seeing half the lights still on. I'm sure, like everywhere else, there was deadweight, a bunch of legacy kids playing away, but when it came around to college admissions, they mostly got what they deserved.
And besides, you are forgetting about that big proportion of the student body who were neither prep or magnet schoolers, but simply graduated valedictorian from the local high school and managed to stand out enough from the other valedictorians from the other local high schools to convince an ivy league school to let them in. That kid was one in a student body of hundreds or thousands, he had many friends who didn't have a shot in hell at an ivy league, didn't study all that hard, and in short he felt the pressure to choose between developing a social life and getting the grades, which I know us prep school kids did not feel as much, and I presume magnet school kids felt to a lesser degree as well.
Asian Dominatrix:
"1, 2.1, 2.2.,3 or fail"
there's no such thing as a "General" anymore? always thought there was but maybe i was wrong ...
T.H. Lien
Thursday, January 24, 2002 at 22:23:32 (PST)
Akash,
When you say "we may actually be lower on creative aspect of intelligence" would you please clarify that "we" means Indians, not the Chinese. If you haven't noticed, in American schools Chinese excel at everything including the arts! To sum it up, Chinese are superior to Indians.
Thanks.
Miss China
Thursday, January 24, 2002 at 17:22:48 (PST)
canadian chic,
I spent some time in the public school system in Montreal and even went to see a cousin on mine at McGill. Trust me there light years apart from the American counterparts. The resources are not up to par with America. You have 1/10 of the population of the USA. There is no way to generate the amount of capital the some of the top schools in the USA using every fiscal year to stay ahead. Trust me McGill is not as selective as top 3 ivies in the USA, at least from an American applicant point of view. Maybe they just want USD paying the tuition.
As for race relations, sure it is not as violent as the USA. But you can't dismiss the whole Francophone thing. Nor pissing off the natives american in Canada every now and then. It not pretty in Canada either.
The only reason you think you don't have problems is because you have 1/10 of the USA population spread out over a similar amount of land mass.
AC dropout
Thursday, January 24, 2002 at 14:38:15 (PST)
hs am,
"You're saying kids at Andover, Exeter, Choate etc. work harder than kids at Stuyvesant, Bronx Science, etc."
I can't speak for the other kids at the other HS but Bronx Science .....hmmm.... the playground of my teenage angst during my pimple face stage.
The were a lot asian there that wanted to be preceived as not working too hard and would coast on the natural intellect into ivy league school. But of the 20-30 of the kids that made it to the top 3 ivys. Asians were also on the top end of the SAT and GPA curve.
The Vale Victorian of my year opted not to goto a top 3 ivy school and went to a state school for a full 4 year scholarship. He later went back to one of the top 3 ivy school to do his grad. work. As he stated to me when we graduated, "Why pay for something you can get for free." But when you that smart I guess you can afford to be cocky.
AC dropout
Thursday, January 24, 2002 at 13:18:35 (PST)
Asian Dominatrix,
"Personally, if I were an admissions officer, I'd prefer to pick someone with higher scores from a school in a less affluent neighborhood"
If that was the case in the real world. There alway Bronx High School Science. Located in one of the one of the poorest sections of the Boogie Down Bronx, NY. A gaggle of nerds in every class room, ready to be beat up from the students of Dewitt Clinton HS right next door.
AC dropout
Thursday, January 24, 2002 at 11:27:57 (PST)
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