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GOLDSEA |
ASIAMS.NET |
ASIAN AMERICAN ISSUES
ARE IVY DEGREES WORTH THE SACRIFICES
nding their kids to elite universities is the dream of every Asian American parent. Or so it seems. And there is no shortage of young AA willing to oblige. As of 2000, Asian Americans made up 12-19% of the undergrad enrollments of the top-20 ivies.
No one questions the prestige associated with ivy degrees. In fact, sneer critics, that's the only thing bought with the extra money. And even that, they add, is wearing thin in a nation in which he cultural center of gravity has shifted to California.
It's true that investments in high ivy tuitions often don't show up in career earnings when compared with graduates of public universities of comparable student body profiles. But the criticisms run deeper than return on investment. Some Asian Americans who have attended ivy league colleges have come away regretting their decisions for other reasons.
Foremost is the sense that the ivies are structured for the benefit of legatees, the progeny of blueblooded alumni. Comprising upwards of 40% of some ivies, the legatees are often exempted from stringent admissions standards. The result is that AA students with excellent credentials are the workhorses preserving the institutions' high academic reputations, thereby giving a free ride to undeserving legatees.
Another common complaint is that the deck is stacked socially against Asian males in a system designed to preserve the princely status quo of the scions of WASP families. A disproportionate number of attractive AA females are admitted by the ivies, some have observed, while far fewer attractive AA males are admitted. This subtle bias, suspect critics, is implemented in the screening interviews used by most ivies.
Then there's the Eurocentric worldview imposed by the courses. Not to mention the lousy weather, bland food and having to put up with locals hostile toward Asians. Contrast all this against the majority-ease lifestyles enjoyed by the AA in, say, the UC campuses.
The bragging rights an ivy education affords parents, conclude critics, are far outweighed by the psychic and emotional sacrifices exacted from their kids.
Does an ivy education provide rewards commensurate with the sacrifices? Or is it a trap for AA with overzealous parents with old-world views?
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WHAT YOU SAY
[This page is closed to new input. --Ed.]
(Updated
Tuesday, Apr 1, 2008, 06:00:59 PM)
Valley Chinese Dude,
Experience is overrated. That's why bad CEOs or professional coaches keep getting re-hired. Experience helps, but you've got to give potential a chance. The experience argument is what keeps incompentent people in their jobs. People are too lazy or stupid to train people without experience. If you do put in the time, the payoffs can be massive.
Grung
Tuesday, July 30, 2002 at 14:34:53 (PDT)
Human nature:
1. People insult what they envy.
2. There are two ways to make yourself feel good. Lift yourself above others or try to bring others down. Unfortunately, most choose the latter.
3. The more people try to justify something, the more deep down they feel insecure about it.
Truth Hurts
Tuesday, July 30, 2002 at 14:20:10 (PDT)
Unfortunately, one problem you face if you go to an Ivy League school is Ivy-envy. Whether people will admit it or not, people who didn't go to an Ivy League school (even if they chose not to) often have a chip on their shoulder about not having gone to an Ivy school. Now, there are plenty of smart and talented people who didn't go to an Ivy League school and there are plenty of idiots (especailly white legatees) who did go Ivy.
Nevertheless, Ivy-envy is a huge problem. I and a number of my friends faced this problem when looking for jobs. Many potentialy employers who didn't go Ivy schools would go out of their way to tell me how bad my school was and how they would never want to go to my school.
I would never think of insulting where they went to school. In fact, I don't care where they went to school. I think the choice of school is a personal one. But they chose to bring it up. This hampered my job search and I ended getting offers from only people with Ivy backgrounds. That was not my intention. But I had no choice but to pick one of those jobs. And I can tell you that I never face problems when people do not know from where I graduated. Truly intelligent people are secure in where they went to school and what they have done, whether you didn't go to college, went to a county college, a state college, or an Ivy school.
Hank
Tuesday, July 30, 2002 at 14:17:41 (PDT)
I C:
It isn't just happening in UC schools. In British Columbia, Canada, a right wing politician openly said that Asians were flooding the Universities there. I think a lot of whites are worried about their entrance into universities because Asians generally work harder than they do. I also think there are definitely quotas in some universities that don't allow a certain number of Asians. Most non-Asian, especially whites, are just jealous of the fact that Asians are on average, better academics.
Combinatorics and Optimization
Tuesday, July 30, 2002 at 13:57:09 (PDT)
I can vouch for No true IT manager would hire IVY @higher pay.
I'm a software developer and from my years of experience in the industry, I can tell you a degree means very little, let alone one from a prestigious school. Most of the people in IT i've met don't even have a technical degree. I'm one of the few people I've met with an actual degree in computer science.
At the last dot-com I worked at, our webmaster had a theatre degree. Our IT manager an English degree. A lot of other people had business/finance degrees. Bottom line: companies hire people that have the skills. They don't have time to mess around with people with all theory and no experience.
If given the choice between the Ivy leaguer with a 3.9 GPA and zero hours of professional experience or some guy from a lowly school with all the hot skills/tools of today and the experience, I guarantee you, 9 times out of 10, companies will take the guy with experience.
Valley Chinese Dude
Monday, July 29, 2002 at 20:47:12 (PDT)
If you're pursuing Computer Science, Information Technology, Short of MIT, CAlTech. IVY for C.S. are simply a paper item, infact you will be left behind in the technology race, it is not every 6 months, but every month that new technology appear, and paradigm shifts occur. Intelligent MIS, Information managers give little weight to ivy (infact they shun them), the need for hackers, security experts, coders, databasers, the best come without a paper degree, its a natural born talent, born intelligence, self taught know-how,keeping up with real life changes, not dusty books.
No true IT manager would hire IVY @higher pay
Sunday, July 28, 2002 at 20:16:47 (PDT)
Seung-Joo Lee, Northwestern '03:
I once saw a T-shirt that read: "Harvard: The Harvard of the East." :-)
TexAsian
Friday, July 26, 2002 at 11:50:40 (PDT)
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