Martial Arts & Fighting Forms | Asian American Poll

MARTIAL ARTS & FIGHTING FORMS
(Updated Tuesday, Apr 1, 2008, 05:13:06 PM to reflect the 100 most recent valid responses.)

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WHAT YOU SAY

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One thing that I've been reading up in the world of MMA sports is that the Gracies are not the top dogs anymore. Their claims of beating all styles is over like a false bravado of Spanish guys. E Macho comMacho.

Anyway the reasoning for this is that there are many ethnicities who are trying to capture the ASIAN Martial arts bandwagon. Like the Gracies saying that it is Brazilian Jutjusu but in reality it is Japanese Judo or a form of Judo with groundfighting and wrestling in it. Their founder Helio was a student of Judo but had to modify it to fit his smaller stature. He found it better to wrap around his opponent by getting so close to his that a taller person would be tangled up and ineffective in punching or kicking the daylights out of him while he would use his limbs to slowly trap and strangle his opponent. Hmmmmm.. could he have modify his style to fit the environment? Brazil is a jungle with lots of snakes especially the Anaconda or Boa Constrictors. His MO would be to fight like a Boa and constrict the body and limbs of his opponent until he passes out. Thus you see a reliance on grappling and groundfighting so that the smaller guy with the snake method can squezze the life out of his advesary. What can counter that? The Eagle Claw or Cranes beak method?

But anyway he developed his own style which apparently worked for a while until people got smarter and not close in and stay out of range. But I like the way he taught all his sons and they all like up like some family mafia in pictures just like the other ones like the Urquidez family of the Benny the Jet fame were they all have his brothers and half-cousins all lined up like a family gang. HE (Benny the Jet) even writes in his books that their whole family would take martial arts lessons from different karate teachers and at the end of the day they would gather up all the knowledge and display it to all the family members what they have learn and thus came up with their own style like Karate Kempo which is Okinawan Karate of several styles just to make a name for themselves. Now Benny has combined it to be Ukido the "U" guess where? and the "kido" for all the other arts he took or studied otherwise. There was even talk that the Gracies were once called on their challenge to fight for money and they actually kick Benny's ass though you never hear Benny say he ever lost a match in his life! 49 an 0, 49 and 0, never defeated. Hmmmmm. Also he has added wrestling as part of Ukido to cover any lack of incompleteness of his created art.

Why I am spewing this out? Because I want people to see that these martial arts I just mentioned are what you called stolen or copied martial arts, changed and modified for only the sake of money and ego with no real traditions or anything worthwhile. Just like deciding to your family from this day forward we are going to start a new religion and It will be strangely be under our name and likeness and yet we are still different from the mainstream religion. Like a rogue style becoming vogue.

I know people will say that they did it on their own efforts and yah yah yah but if you look deep enough at their origin you see nothing but bogarting a traditional style, mismatching it and claiming as your own. Truely, like being a fake. Add to the fact you also have the Latin Machoism and ego put in with their "I'm better than you" attitude with it. Sorry but it makes me feel cheap and used with it. Like a bad Mexican meal.

Even Bruce Lee with his Jeet Kun Do never said his art was the ultimate but an expression of what worked for him. He even regretted naming his art because of the sake of people's ego and he was right.

All these other lame ducks mentioned and others are just trying to cash in on the latest fad and making martial arts other than what it is was intended to be, which is to defend yourself. Not a sportwrestling or a Kickboxing event.

So Maybe there is some truth that the non-asians are taking over the Asian martial arts or maybe it is just another round of self-proclaimed and self-titled masters looking for the big fall coming to them.

Enough.
Mar-nut Sunday, November 17, 2002 at 02:39:40 (PST) [209.245.11.169]

latinalovingkoreanhombre,

It took 14 white nations and one Japan to team up to fight China in that Boxer Rebellion war.

The Manchus and the Chinese rank and file soldiers were shot down like flies, but the true Chinese "sifu" (kung-fu masters) survived without a scratch. There was one Mongolian general in the Ching army (Chingerinchin) who may have known some "chi" and he routed a combined British/French regiment near Beijing.
wushu Saturday, November 16, 2002 at 01:36:05 (PST) [64.130.235.33]

TaekWonDo. Two Hands Down!!!
Los Angeles Friday, November 15, 2002 at 21:49:34 (PST) [218.152.200.82]

"Taekwondo went beyond Korean cultural boundary and the world accepts Taekwondo as offical sport of Olympic. Isn't that Universal learning?"

No, it ain't. Olympia is the fun for the rich who consume it. It's a progress for businessmen, not martial artists.

"So guys learn from your narrow minded cultural ideology staying exclusive to your own cultural boundary does not help Martial Art development."

Wasn't it Taekwondo which had that military ideology? Military and culture or arts nearly exclude each other. Martial arts develop with(in) the individual, not with the masses. Nowadays everybody with some muscles can say, "i'm a (martial) artist." -Ridiculous!! Modern ideology in martial "arts" is capitalism.
immigrant Friday, November 15, 2002 at 16:40:00 (PST) [62.227.111.185]

To Wushu and Bushi

You both argue that true martial arts should be preserved. Martial art is a worthless sport?? Its pretty sad that you both think like that toward your martial arts from your country.

I agree if martial art stays exclusive toward your own cultural boundary it will be worthless martial art. If martial art cannot go beyond your own cultural boundary it will be worthless sport. Taekwondo went beyond Korean cultural boundary and the world accepts Taekwondo as offical sport of Olympic. Isn't that Universal learning? How does Taekwondo stack up compared to KungFu or Karate?? The answer is Taekwondo has stacked up better than Kungfu and Karate put together. So guys learn from your narrow minded cultural ideology staying exclusive to your own cultural boundary does not help Martial Art development.
Korea bostonseoul@hotmail.com Thursday, November 14, 2002 at 17:25:32 (PST) [218.152.204.228]

wushu:
Re: "guns and blades can not penetrate"
One answer: BOXER REBELLION
18th century firearms vs. "chinese martial artists."
Result: western domination of china/dead wushu, kung-fu chinese "uber warriors"
Conclusion: bullets and blades do penetrate.
latinalovingkoreanhombre Thursday, November 14, 2002 at 12:58:30 (PST) [205.150.212.4]

It's sad to see so many people refer to modern taekwondo as a martial art. The way it is today is nothing more than a worthless sport.
Bushi Thursday, November 14, 2002 at 07:24:17 (PST) [206.72.32.42]

Korea,

No white man or black man will ever truly comprehend kung-fu and wushu arts. The Chinese will not give it away easily, because no one can truly understand the art.

The appex of Chinese kung-fu/wushu has a term in our language: "do chang bu nei." It means: "guns and blades cannot penetrate."

A true kung-fu master is invincible to blade wounds or bullets because he has acquired the highest level of "chi" (inner and outer forces of this universe).

In fact, very few Chinese are true acknowledged masters of the chi. If such art was widespread and widely taught, people would start killing each other by the seconds.
wushu Wednesday, November 13, 2002 at 22:24:28 (PST) [64.130.235.33]

To Wushu

Its called sharing cultures. Taekwondo became popular in United States because people had a access to the martial arts. Taekwondo is a perfect martial art for self defence. Even Bruce Lee adopted Taekwondo. His newly found martial art sounds similiar to Taekwondo/ Jeet kun do. Whereas Chinese martial art its still exclusive its hidden in the backstreets of Chinatown.
Korea bostonseoul@hotmail.com Sunday, November 10, 2002 at 23:09:51 (PST) [218.152.203.226]

"Do you think Asian are superman? Its like saying White Americans or Europeans should be shame loosing baseball or soccer to asians."

Well, it was a total shame that USA basketball got SIXTH PLACE in the World Championships. Yes, it is embarassing to be defeating handly in the sport that your country created. However, on the same token, kung fu wasn't created as a competition sport, so it's a bit different.

"It's not true that non-Asians often beat Asians in the Martial Arts."

Even watch Pride or UFC? Most of the champs are non-Asian, and they most certainly have their fair share of Asian combatants. The majority of the bigshot fighters are from USA, eastern block nations, and Brazil, with Japan being the sole Asian country representing. I wonder how come only Japan comes out? Why are there never any Chinese San Shou fighters? Or Thai kickboxers? Muay Thai seems to be effective in the MMA arena, but all the practitioners are non-Asian. I do remember the first UFC had a Chinese Wing Chun practitioner who absolutely got whooped bad by a wrestler.
TSJ Eric@KristinKreuk.net Friday, November 08, 2002 at 11:58:25 (PST) [66.81.52.96]

mar-nut

Urr you mean 5-10 pds on pressure points. Yes the requires you to get the person in the position to break their bones, which is very very hard.

85 pd lady do damage? LOL thats funny. Sorry she would need a 9mm to do that.

martial arts is good, but lets be realistic ok?
SOG Tuesday, November 05, 2002 at 13:53:10 (PST) [128.193.169.87]

The real fact of the matter is the ability of the combatants in their respective martial arts.

Size does matter but skill and training play an important function in anything as well as willpower and fortitude of the individual.

You can be a huge wrestler type and still be defeated by a hungry starving skinny bum who hasn't seen food for days. It all depends on wheither you want to win badly enough.

How many times if you are willing to go through hell to get what you want, you will out perform and beat your competition? Faith and will play a big part of the equation of winning in a Martial sport. Usually when you do fight it is in a even weight class so size and weight should not be a factor. The bottom line in those competitions is the willingness to go to the end. The Jet guy you mentioned won because he didn't care if he won or lost only just to hit the crap out of you.

Size in itself is only one factor in a fight. It may give you a added psychological advantage intially and you may be able to absorb more blows than a skinnier person but the same thing is if you don't have the will to fight than you can lose.

The asian fighters have an advantage of better training and more skills sets but what they need to do more of is to practice hitting harder ( so they can hit like someone in a heavier weight division as well as it creates a avoidance to get hit by thier opponent) and The whole trick is to use your whole body in striking, keeping your whole body relaxed and using as much of your body weight behind it. It only takes 5 to 10 pounds of force to break a average bone some parts even less; with your whole body behind your blows, even a short chinese lady with only 85 pounds can do some damage.

It is all relative.
Mar-nut Tuesday, November 05, 2002 at 01:24:53 (PST) [199.174.225.46]

That is why the Chinese don't like to open kungfu gyms in a lot of American cities. They want to preserve the true form of kungfu and not sell it out to whites, blacks and Mexicans. I think Korean and Japanese teach too much and too fast to other races.

If we keep kungfu to ourselves, it will help our young ones in case of combat with outside races.
wushu Monday, November 04, 2002 at 21:56:17 (PST) [64.130.235.33]

why is it a shame that asians lose in their own sport or martial arts to other group of race and culture?
Do you think Asian are superman? Its like saying White Americans or Europeans should be shame loosing baseball or soccer to asians.
korea bostonseoul@hotmail.com Sunday, November 03, 2002 at 07:10:03 (PST) [211.110.6.211]

It's not true that non-Asians often beat Asians in the Martial Arts. As a 20 year veteran, it is only in the U.S. and Europe that non-Asian prevail. In the full-contact far east circuit, it is still dominated mainly by Asians. The only non-Asian who became champion was Benny 'the jet' Urquidez
Sam Choi Wednesday, October 30, 2002 at 16:25:10 (PST) [128.32.147.171]

"It is such shame that non-Asians often beat the Chinese, Japanese and Koreans in their own respective national martial arts: kungfu, karate, taekwando.":

this doesn't matter. All official martial arts competitions nowadays have to do with losing anonymity. Once someone is on the top he will soon lose his face because everybody has different expectations. No chance to act sensibly. Anyway, the old people of age 40 or so are said to be the best martial artists of Asia. And they're mature enough not to compete with unserious whites. Internal power makes martial arts what they are.
not just for fun Tuesday, October 29, 2002 at 11:09:04 (PST) [62.226.252.243]

It is such shame that non-Asians often beat the Chinese, Japanese and Koreans in their own respective national martial arts: kungfu, karate, taekwando.

This has a lot to do with size.

But, with better nutrition, it will someday be on par.

Asians still have a more natural aggressive mindset compared to other races. If you combine that with physical power, you see that they are hungry wolves.
wushu Wednesday, October 23, 2002 at 21:15:33 (PDT) [64.130.235.33]

Alot of Chinese people understand the importance of martial arts but because many of them are lazy and not motivated like White Americans, thus the level of true martial arts has fallen in this country.

And also add to the fact that the martial arts practiced in the motherland CHina or PRC most of it is Wushu and watered down to conform to the party line. Even Tai-chi is watered down so it is only a dance as opposed to a fighting art. Besides for Wushu and any hard martial arts style like gymnastics, you can only do it when you are young. After a certain age you have to practise a internal style. Even then you have to practise a traditional internal style and not a watered down wushu version of it.

Thus most of what you see and hear is a fake and a fraud. Maybe this generation of Chinese knows this and rather play baseball than do phoney martial arts.
Mar-nut Wednesday, October 23, 2002 at 12:35:32 (PDT) [199.174.233.132]

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