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ASIAMS.NET |
ASIAN AMERICAN ISSUES
Are AA Women the Real Victims of Prejudice?
sian women get a free ride at the expense of Asian men. That's the received wisdom here in the U.S. This belief appears premised on the suspicion that American society sees Asian women as sexy exotics in need of rescuing from the cold clutches of Asian men who don't know how to smile except evilly.
The real victim?
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Credit Hollywood for its tireless casting of Asian women as sexual accessories to white heroes while suppressing the very existence of Asian men except as unsavory paper tigers. Credit too the TV networks that uncover bevies of talking Asian women but rarely their male counterparts.
In fairness this media fantasy of the Asian race was partly inspired by recent history. Devastated and impoverished Asian nations sent tens of thousands of war brides and orphans, followed by several million desperate immigrants willing to hock their identities while toiling to build new lives.
Male-dominated societies toast new women as exotic sexual prospects while suppressing new men as an exploitable lower class or even enemy aliens. The women get all the breaks and the men get all the lumps. Even worse, the women have their heads turned and adopt a scornful attitude toward their own men. So goes the complaint of some AA men.
The women have a different take. Sexual predators bearing insulting stereotypes must be fended off while coping with women who see them as unfair competitors. Add to that the pain of being scorned as sellouts by AA men for no more reason than their apparent welcome by American society. Worst of all, complain AA women, is being begrudged the right to take simple pleasure in their own identities. How much easier just to face straightforward racial prejudice!
Do Asian women really have an easier time in America? Or do they suffer from the double-whammy of insulting stereotypes from non-Asians and unfair persecution from Asian men?
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WHAT YOU SAY
[This page is closed to new input. --Ed.]
(Updated
Tuesday, Apr 1, 2008, 06:10:49 PM)
Here are some thoughts:
1)I'm kind of shocked at Asian-Male resentment, even though I'm an Asian-Male myself, and these urban legends or too often repeated stories. Sure, Joy Luck Club is a joke and a shame...a manifestation of self hatred and orientalist and neo-colonialist imagery masked behind a pseudo-multiculturalism that gives racism some legitimacy. It's a tear jerker for females, and Asian females, but it's not "reality"--but a filter to a reality that simply reinforces stereotypes. So that the extreme brutality and individualism of American male treatment, even those Ivy-educated sensitive new age types sometimes, manifested in rapes, date rapes, the grotesque dating scene, and the abuse and use of young women is completely ignored in favor of the "chauvinism" and ignorance of Asian society---study some Edward Said people!!! Aren't people supposed to read Edward Said these days in the politically correct university or has learning been reduced to chanting and slogans and music video, consciousness raising. It's a one sided battle of simplistic, MTV images and slogans and abstractions--of Tom Cruise, Shaq against Fu man chu and Michael Chang...Sex in the City--in real life that is not such a good reality for American women and an almost self-hating submission trying to show it's not being so submissive and losing the war of the sexes...well, so I'm not an Asian male basher and certainly know all about the negative images against Asian males BUT...
The level of resentment I've encountered among some Asian males against Asian females not dating Asian males is ridiculous...and the rationalizations they make about self-hatred, or only ugly ones, or not sticking to Asian culture--self-hatred there is some truth but not ALL or even most Asian girls I know are led to that. Certainly we see many more images of white beauty growing up...funny when you actually go to Korea or Japan--never been to China--and come back to the U.S. the reality is fat and ugly not Tom Cruise and Nicole Kidman...
BUT, I knew all these Asian males who were so insecure in dating or were so full of BS--well, we are all full of BS rationalizations for our egos--like she's a traitor, or when seeing an asian girl with a white man they immediately say she's insecure or the white guy is a dunce...or even faces turning red when seeing a white guy with an Asian girl...it's a sign of weakness!!! Of course, you can't just get over it, but ranting actually makes it worse. I won't say Asian males are this and that--more stupid MTV style, modern-American, mob jargon--white and black males haver their own particular psychoses--if they are on the level of that--just as ugly--we just don't notice them in these chat rooms. If you're five guys without girlfriends and complaining about asian females--get a life!
But this resentment is uglier than the thing they are railing against. Go out and work out, ask a girl out, or whatever...
2)Urban Legends--e.g., if an Asian guy goes out with a white girl he'll get all kinds of looks...what in the world?!...I'm assuming most of those who say this are from New York or California. My brother and I have dated mainly white girls, some pretty attractive, and have not gotten many looks or whatever...and this is the MIDWEST!!! Or maybe we just don't give a damn! It's almost like whoever writes this needs to make excuses for his own inadequacies or is so self-conscious of dating a white girl or seeing a white girl with an Asian guy that they interpret every nod or gesture as unwanted or wanted attention. What's funny is I've seen Asian guys give my girlfriend and I the most attention like...Asian Pride!!--wow! he's going out with a white girl...score one for the brother!
2b)White women think Asian men are not interested in them...what in the hell--again!? Is this true, I certainly haven't found that to be the case. I think it's another rationalization and/or white women making excuses for a real unattraction to the image they have in their mind of Asian men--which I believe is not reality. If a woman is attracted to a man, even in the early 1900s white women went after black men, she may react differently because he is Asian...but she will certainly give off signals--but it's the man's job--sorry but I wish it were otherwise--I truly do--but have found this to be the case-- to ask her out and initiate anyways--it's not like women will ask you out unless you're really attractive and she is really bold. I really think, if white women do say this or even Asian women--it's because they don't find the image of Asian men appealing--BUT, BUT you can overcome this if you're attractive--and there are ALOT of clueless duds out there...except for the 5-10% who really do think you are a monkey, if that many, and don't give them the time of day anyways.
3)Asian girls and their exoticization or sexualization. Well, certainly there are many white and black and other men who have a "fetish" for asian women--but whey the hell is it a "fetish" for someone to like Asian or black women over white women whereas it's not a "fetish" to like white, blondes with blue eyes. Beauty, some things are natural, but much of it is much more complex, embodying cultural ideals, myths, simplistic images--all pointing to our partly culturally programmed ideal of perfection and beauty...So stop saying it's a fetish--we should not necessarily decry men who like asian women--though ultimately we might if it's based on bad stereotypes but so is the fetishization--however you spell that word;)--of blondes and blue eyes--though that is a much more positive fetish stereotype of the aryan bs ideal.
AND it seems like many asian women actually, deep or not so deep down inside, like the idea of being the object of attention...So much so that they overplay it way, way too much...Many white men just like asian features or happen to fall in love with an asian woman...and, unfortunately, as to asian men, many whites do not find asian women as appealing as white men...it's like secretly, through the fetish, overplaying it, you are trumping up your ego...
Well, if you've read this far, let me give you a medal...let's stop Asian bashing and infighting...marry and date whoever the hell you want...and if you're an attractive man---all races and types of women will find you attractive too--it's not like your competition is a millionaire, Harvard educated, Jude Law lookalike--if he is then find another game to play.
Hello, Some Thoughts.
Saturday, June 29, 2002 at 22:39:51 (PDT)
to DC Guy
Maybe you find it easier to befriend an Asian guy because you're a guy yourself. Most AMs are friendly to other males of any race, but act differently when females approach them. If you were a girl, I'd bet AFs would be quite friendly with you. But since you're a male, of course we'd be a little suspicious if you're trying to be friendly with us. We've seen one too many sleeze-ball, coming across as being friendly only to get gross and unappropriate.
MLK
Saturday, June 29, 2002 at 17:36:51 (PDT)
DC GUY, all of those characteristics you have attributed to AA females can be found in me also,an AA male.Things like perceived sleights, hair triggers,scowl on my face, always on high alert,many insults happen when I am in non-chalant mode, yes I own all of those and more! I am a carbon copy of what you have described, its weird. I think that where I live, since there is a very sizeable Asian population, many of the whites have relegated Asians (as well as other minorities)to inferior status. The whites are maybe semi or unconscious of their attitude and behavior and they act this out when our paths cross. So we AA don't like this kind of attitude on their part and call them on it in various ways. If we don't do these things 'they'will ride roughshod all over us. It makes for a better tomorrow.
A NEW DAY COMING
Saturday, June 29, 2002 at 06:55:11 (PDT)
I'm a WF, and all but one of the AFs I've known personally are immigrants and are very nice. The one who was born in the US was the meanest, most spiteful person I've ever encountered. I'm sorry to say that, but it's true. She even got fired from where we worked at the time, she was that awful. And not long ago, I was standing in line at a store, and 2 AFs were talking about how their cousin only likes white girls, and how lame they think that is. I was standing right there, and I though it was incredibly rude. I realize this is coincidence, and I wouldn't avoid meeting American-born AFs in the future, but it sure makes me think.
a bit wary of American-born AFs
Friday, June 28, 2002 at 11:10:12 (PDT)
What about this shortage of women in China that I keep reading about? It seems that because of various factors, including government policies and an extreme preference for male babies, there is a huge shortage of marriage-age women in China, a deficit of about 40 million, soon to be 50 million.
Some of the magazine articles I've read in the US press predict that this will cause China to be more belligerent, looking for wars around its borders perhaps in a bid to occupy unwed men (who would otherwise be in their hometowns stirring up trouble), and perhaps... even to appropriate foreign women from other surrounding countries to make up for the shortage.
I don't want to make any dire predictions, but could we see China invading countries like Vietnam, Thailand, and even Japan or Korea in search of women?
I say this with the utmost respect for the Chinese Americans and the people of China, who I think are one of the most misunderstood people in the world. China has contributed so much culturally that it dwarfs many other nations. I'm just bringing this out as a discussion topic. There are also many legitimate threats to China, such as Muslim extremists and militants in the Xinjiang Region, which are supported by Osama bin Laden. Will all these factors stretch China's military too thin?
Learning More
Friday, June 28, 2002 at 11:05:38 (PDT)
JING CHA,
So you've read the PRC constitutions and the ROC constitutions. And read the Four Books and Five Classic of Chinese literature. I thought your defense of being a Chinese expert was that you were engaged to a ShangDong girl.
AC Dropout
Friday, June 28, 2002 at 08:36:41 (PDT)
Sociologist,
"If they are self-supporting with their money from back home, would they be allowed to stay or would they have to leave?"
By definition those are mostly tourist and students. So they are allow to stay because they do not burden the social services of HK as much. And they spend money in HK without getting much in return in let say the public school system or waiting for housing space. A majority of people in this situation will leave HK eventually.
But with the mainland illegal is mostly an issue of where does it end. Parents come over illegally, then they bring the kids, then the extended family. They tax the housing system and the local schools. And set bad precident for the island in dealing with other migrant mainlanders looking for work. HK is extremely limited in it available land.
I'm not saying there doesn't exist self-haters in HK society. But I don't think your example reflected that. I mean a more appropriate example would be some of the Chinese girls that worked in dance hall that would try to hook up with a white police officer, Ah'Sir, in hope of immigrating to the UK. But in the entire HK population those were only a very, very small number. No more frequent than USA white people who have self hate from their repressive history and marry black people or join the Al Qeaeda. It is more of an example of Properties of Large Numbers, than anything of any socialogical importance.
AC Dropout
Friday, June 28, 2002 at 08:29:41 (PDT)
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