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ASIAMS.NET |
ASIAN AMERICAN ISSUES
ASIAN ATHLETES LIMITED BY GENES OR NURTURE?
o debate on the prospects of Asian athletes in American sports passes without mention of Yao Ming, the Shanghai Sharks's 7-6, 265-pound center who recently led China to an 83-82 upset over the U.S. His prospects as the likely top pick of the 2002 NBA draft have been trumpeted by no lesser authorities than Michael Jordan and Bill Walton.
But the 21-year-old superstar is literally one in a billion (1.25 billion to be exact). Young Yao is the product, genetically and culturally, of a 6-10 father and 6-4 mother, both of whom played basketball for China's national teams. His case is as likely to confuse the nature-vs-nurture debate as to help resolve it. After all, his height may be merely the tip of the genetic iceberg when it comes to his promise as a world-class basketballer.
More familiar to Asian Americans are Michael Chang (5-9) who won the French Open at age 17, and Ichiro Suzuki (5-9), whose batting and base-stealing have lifted the Mariners from the basement to the heavens. Both seem endowed with standard physical equipment but have outperformed more powerful physiques. And on the women's side Kristi Yamaguchi, Michele Kwan, Seri Pak and legions of Chinese divers and gymnasts have shown that champions needn't be amazons.
But these successes haven't silenced those who argue that as a race Asians lack the genetic gifts to challenge black and white athletes in power sports. Asians are genetically smaller and weaker, they claim, and can only excel in sports calling for quickness and agility. They cite Asian underrepresentation in track and field, football, basketball, soccer, tennis, boxing and the like.
Will the future mirror the past? Are we genetically limited to excelling only in a few select sports or will changing social and economic conditions produce a generation of Asian superstars across the sports spectrum?
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WHAT YOU SAY
[This page is closed to new input. --Ed.]
(Updated
Tuesday, Apr 1, 2008, 05:57:51 PM)
Athletic accomplishments have not been emphasized in Asian cultures because in the big picture, sports is not that important.
How many people realistically in America, regardless of your race, can make a great living in professional sports. Sure there are some great athletes in all races. But they are a very small percentage of the total population.
A professional athlete do not have that choice. No matter how great their athletic skills are, time will erode those skills to where they are no longer able to compete at the highest level, and they eventually have to retire.
I much rather make my money as a professional business man. I don't have to risk injuring my body, and I can retire when I want to.
Old Glory
Tuesday, October 09, 2001 at 00:10:30 (PDT)
Here's what I read about Asian genetically and phenologically (natural body types) by Jon Entine (who wrote "Taboo: Why Black Athletes Dominate Sports") (He has an Asian version coming out soon).
West Africans and their descendants (most African Americans) have longer extremities, shorter torsos, less fat and have "fast twitch" muscles-the key for quick burst of speed and jumping (e.g. sprinting). East Africans have slow twitch muscles which is good for endurance, higher lung capacity- hence excellent marathon runners from Kenya and Ethiopia.
Whites-have more fat than blacks, more slow twitch muscles, have comparative advantage in upper body strength- hence they dominate weightlifting, wrestling in the Olympics, as well as swimming (greater fat than blacks and stronger upper body).
East Asians (and Southeast Asians) have stronger extremities and longer torso, plus greater amount of fat in certain areas, smaller bodies, higher amount of slow twitch muscles. In terms of running- Asians are not competitive in sprinting or middle distance (there is a chart-virutally no Asians are in the top 100 in these events). However, when it comes to ultra long running events such as marathons- Asians are competitive (look who won the Boston Marathon in 2001- a Korean or the 1992 Olympics in marathon- a Korean runner). They have slower twitch muscles and certain fats which is key for endurance. Interesting to note: there were virtually no people of west african descent (including african-americans because they have fast twitch muscles-not good for endurance) in the top 100 marathon runners (all the africans were east africans not west africans).
Asians, general do not have a comparative advantage when it comes to sports where size or short burst of speed is required. But do better in endurance sports, sports require flexibility or quick-hand eye coordination.
Jon Entine also noted that Asians-with the shorter extremities have greater flexibility (note: the Chinese divers or gymnastist or even some figure skaters).
That is also key to martial arts- flexibility, dexterity.
Studies also show that Asians have, on average, faster hand-eye coordination (key to sports such as table tennis/ping pong or racquet/net sports such as badminton).
If you want a copy of what Jon Entine wrote about Asians (he personally sent this to me), I can e-mail it to you (if you e-mail me)
Descendants of the Min-Yueh
chen_taiway@hotmail.com
Monday, October 08, 2001 at 19:46:25 (PDT)
Hey, I'm 16 and I'm the captain of my highschool basketball team... and I'm only a junior too. I'm 5'11" but I can dunk a basketball with two hands. But the best part of my game is my ballhandling and playmaking. I'm looking to play for either UCLA or UC Berkeley when I go to college. That way, I can take my shot at some of the Best PAC-10 schools, and if that fails, also get a great education.
There actually was a Korean-American point guard who played for Cal about 3 years ago. He was a reserve guard (5-7) who was famous on campus for making a HUGE stop (collected an offensive charge) against Baron Davis, who was a UCLA star (and now a star with the Charlotte Hornets). Cal won that game, thanks to him. I think Asians have a great future in sports -- all those idiots on the East coast need to come and ball with us Asian boys on the West coast. We will make it to the mountain top, eventually.
Look for me at Cal or UCLA
Monday, October 08, 2001 at 18:10:12 (PDT)
Asian guy,
I NEVER said Asians were at a disadvantage because of size! Size
is only one of the variables determining
athleticism. There are plenty of other variables, such as body shape and muscle composition. It is obvious by looking at people of different races, even if they happen to be the same height, there are inherent physical differences between the different races. READ carefully and don't concoct your own stories from your poor comprehension skills.
You're another dillusional Asian who's letting his ego get in the way of reality. Even White people concede the fact that they can't compete with Blacks in most sports even though they are comparable in size with Blacks. Yet you and some other dillusionaries continue to contrive these unreal counterarguments and phallacies. Get real.
There are plenty of White athletes the size of Kobe Bryant, Vince Carter, and Michael Jordan. Do you see those White athletes doing 360 dunks and dunking from the free throw line? Do you see any White wide receivers doing 4 ft vertical jumps and catching the ball with one hand like Randy Moss? Do you see any non-blacks Challenging Lennox Lewis or Mike Tyson for their heavy weight titles? If they do they get knocked out in the first round.
A lot of Asians keep arguing that Asians are gaining more head way in the Sports arenas and making names for themselves. No shit! I agreed. I never denied that! You will continue to hear more about Asian athletes. I was just making a point of inherent genetic differences that are FACT and accepted and supported by the medical and scientic commmunities that give Blacks an advantage. Nobody seems to refute that except some dillusionaries on this board like Asian guy and Dan. REad carefully and retort from now on, otherwise you will continue to purvey an image of ignorance.
BTW, there are three asian teams that qualified for the World Cup becaused they played well in the Asian sectionals. Asian soccer teams always get slaughtered when they play European or Latin American teams.
ChicagoGuy
Monday, October 08, 2001 at 15:26:41 (PDT)
Blacks- Good at sports that emphasize speed and leaping ablity and power. Power = speed + strength. Thus sports like basketball, football and baseball are well suited for them. Sports where thier denser bone mass and common larger size can be of asset are boxing and football again. While you might see great black tennis players, long distance runners, and soccer players; they don't enjoy a distinct racial advantage since all of these sports have a mixture of great players of many different races.
White- Generally speaking they excell at Strength sports, Aquatic sports and Winters. These are sports where they enjoy a racial advantage. All the great Olympic powerlifters and Worlds Strongest Man competitiors are white. Swimming is dominated by them and Winter sports as well due to thier countless years of experience and adaptation in snowy climates.
Asians- Enjoy advantages at fast twitch sports and ones that emphasize coordination and balance such as 50 meter dash, table tennis, gymnastics, diving, martial arts weaponry kata. They also enjoy strength for thier size. It lighter weights they dominate powerlifting. Again these are events where they enjoy an advantage due to race.
None of these are hard fast rules but they reflect general trends which go beyond facts such as national interest, wealth of countries and diet.
Lets's be honest
Monday, October 08, 2001 at 11:52:31 (PDT)
Um hum ... today October 7, 2001,
China men'ssoccer team qualified
for next year's world cup.
Recall the USA female soccer team
won a thiller over China a few
years ago. I think China is doing
well in international sports.
Female asian soccer fan
Monday, October 08, 2001 at 05:19:08 (PDT)
I think it is false to think that it takes millions of years to evolve. Evolution is really a rapid transition. How do you think humans suddenly seperated themselves from the apes? Every once in a while, there will be mutants who will skip the evolutionary process for us. Hopefully, mutants attract mutants and they'll give babies to super-mutants. Michael Jordan is a whole foot taller than his entire family so am pretty sure he is a mutant who also accelerated a certain geneological process. Therefore, I do think the Asian race is able to evolve quickly to the necessities of competitive sports. Evolution is environmental and sometimes this focus on professional sports will force a mutation.
Vinny
vinnyboy112@yahoo.com
Sunday, October 07, 2001 at 23:57:47 (PDT)
ChicagoGuy,
I see a very basic fallacy in your type of thinking. i.e. Blacks are better than Whites who are better than Asians because of physical size difference. The top Japanese sprinter can outrun you any day of the year. But you are the one in denial here and instead focus on the fallacy that since you are of the White or Black race, that somehow you have become inherently better by association. Otherwise why the putdown?
I say let the chips fall where they will. Asians have been getting better in sports for several reasons: 1. Better nutrition due to stronger economies 2. Confidence in Asian's abilities -- i.e. not submitting to the type of racist thinking you're trying to suggest. Remember No matter what race we are, we can only achieve 100% of what is genetically possible. therefore it is the mind that often times determines. if one thinks (or believes what others are saying) one is a loser even before entering the playing field, it becomes a self-fullfilling prophesy. Looking back on the history of Asian athletes, it's obvious Asians/ AA athletes don't have this confidence problem. But somehow certain racist non-Asians seem to find it unfathomable that Asians can and do achieve in athletic events without the use of sports-enhancing drugs. 3. Unknown to many, the majority of sports in athletic competitions today are western in origin. I.e. Traditionally Asians were interested in Asian sports such as Chinese Fencing, Muay Thai, Kung Fu, etc., e.g. The Jamaican skiing team isn't going to win any medals anytime soon even though physique-wise, they may have a "natural" knack for the sport. 4. That's why we have weight-classes for many international sports. The lighter weight guys/gals compete with each other, etc.,
Hey, I'm a perfect example of the difference attitude/mind makes for athletic achievement. Although I'm no world-class athlete and I'm definitely not a giant, I believed in myself and even though a slew of people told me that it wasn't possible for an (Asian) person to gain significant amounts of muscle mass, I did just that. I'm now 5'9" and 205 pounds of solid muscle and I did it while I was vegetarian. You heard right, with all that "rotten asian genetics" and no steroids, a vegetarian was able to beat the odds. Now what does that say to the other potential Asian athletes out there. JUST DO IT AND FIND OUT.
And btw, not to sound racist, I have to say this to counter the stereotypes people have about Asian athletes. Pure-blood Asian athletes in Asia are becoming better and better; and maybe if AA can ignore some of the racist stuff going on here, we can find more AA competitive athletes. In fact there was this Chinese athlete in track and field (I believed it was the 100m) who won the university games; his time would have ranked him 5th or 6th in the world. Not bad for Asians who supposedly can't run and considering twenty years ago the same Thai guy year after year, would run track and place last in the semifinals of the Olympics. I recall some Chinese and Japanese women swimmers who got medals in world competitions AFTER BEING DRUG-TESTED. Not bad for Asians who supposedly can't swim. And in all likelihood, CHINA may have a place in World Cup Soccer. In fact since Japan and Korea are host-nations, there will be THREE ASIAN NATIONS IN WORLD CUP SOCCER. And let's not forget the Asians who play soccer for professional football in Europe. AA men are placing in amateur bodybuilding shows in the bodybuilding powerhouse of the world -- i.e U.S.A. Let's have this conversation again, say ten years later -- I bet the tone will have changed quite a bit.
I even see this in my brother's sons, etc., both of them over 6'4", one of them built like a linebacker. Couldn't tell from my brother who's only 5' 9" and weighs 150 pounds. And his wife is even shorter. So obviously nutrition plays a role.
AsianGuy
Sunday, October 07, 2001 at 23:06:50 (PDT)
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