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ASIAN AMERICAN ISSUES
Zhang Ziyi: Major Talent or Lucky Starlet?
(Updated
Tuesday, Apr 1, 2008, 05:49:51 PM)
or some she was the most memorable part of Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon. They were mesmerized by the dark energy she brings to her portrayal of a freespirited young adventuress. For others she was one more annoying thing about a glacial, poorly edited sword-fight flick. They were left cold by the hard, souless gleam of her obsidian eyes and her puckish face.
Regardless of your opinion of Zhang Ziyi, one fact is indisputable: since the release of CTHD in late 2000, the media has lionized the gamin-faced actress. Virtually every glossy and tabloid has hailed her as the hot new Asian female actor and/or great new beauty. In the heat of CTHD's surprise success Zhang was signed to several projects, including Rush Hour 2, The Legend of Zu, 2046 (a science fiction flick), Hero (a Jet Li kung-fu flick) and Musa (a Corean film set during the wars between the Yuan and Ming Dynasties).
Luck is essential to every success, but Zhang Ziyi appears to have enjoyed more than her share during her brief acting career.
She was born February 9, 1979 in Beijing to an economist father and a kindergarten teacher mother. At the age of 11 she enrolled in a dance school. Four years later she decided to switch to acting despite some promise as a dancer. She went for a shampoo commercial audition and was picked out by the legendary director Zhang Yimou to play a schoolgirl who falls in love with her teacher.
When The Road Home was released in China in 1999, the young actress was promptly dubbed "Little Gong Li" on the popular suspicion that she had followed the great actress into Zhang Yimou's bed. (Zhang Yimou had discovered Gong Li in 1987 and lost her in 1994 when she left him to marry Singaporean businessman Ooi Hoe Siong.)
The Road Home received no attention in the U.S. but won the 2000 Jury Grand Prix Silver Bear at the Berlin Film Festival. It also caught the eye of Ang Lee who was casting Crouching Tiger. No one suspected that the low-budget film he was planning to shoot in China would go on to become the next year's most profitable film, ultimately grossing $150 million worldwide. It turned Zhang Ziyi into an international superstar in one fell, elaborately-wired swoop.
Is Zhang Ziyi really a great beauty and first-rate actor? Or is she a second-rater whose fame is as un-credible as her CTHD fight sequences?
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WHAT YOU SAY
[This page is closed to new input. --Ed.]
Extremism adds nothing to the discussion but inflammation. One's argument should base on rationality, locality and hopefully nonchalance. Do not be beguiled by your sensuality and obsession.
"If the greatness of an actress now solely lies on the number of fansites she has, the number of countrymen fans she has, and the make-up on her face, and NOT on pure, raw, unadulterated talent, then this world is turning into a sick, sick Hades for the artist."
In fact zhang ziyi does rely on makeups on her face. She would regret deeply for showing up in camera without any powder. If she didn't forget to wear her "mask" that day, i will probably still be in your league today.
Without supports of fans zhang ziyi is done. Public consensus is one of the best yardstick to gauge one's greatness. Every great actor owns legions of admirers, if not fans. Otherwise prove me wrong here. Who's been considered as a great actor while being hated and despised by everyone else?
Don't you understand why i posted that link in my last post? You asserted zhang yimou to be a perfectionist, but it's not his usual practice to retake one shot over and over again.
You keep confounding me for proof, then i've given you a fraction of the proof. You keep interpreting them the other way around, then i will explain this to you one last time, in slim hope you will understand.
Let me reiterate this, though you may discredit zhang ziyi's own words, she told reporter in one interview as part of ordeal she's gone through, that zhang yimou slated her at the entrance of the village in which they filmed tRH, for her poor acting on the set of the movie. Don't blame the scene, don't blame anything from your imagination,
end of story here.
It's really beyond my comprehension that, on one hand you claimed yourself to be such a dedicated fan, on the other hand, you refuse to recognise what can be seen as part of zhang ziyi's biography.
"Time will prove: no, Time has ALREADY proven Ziyi as a major, major talent. Its just that she's still young and some people just can't accept the fact that someone so young has achieved and accomplished so many things some "actresses" can only dream of doing in a lifetime."
Nope....(head's shaking) Apart from your objectivity this proves nothing. Time itself has proven nothing yet. Zhang ziyi's acting is far from consummate, though she has grounds for enhancement granted that she is indeed dedicated to her craft.
About the proof you are after. It's an article posted in sina.com, it's still in sina's archive. You are either not willing to find it, or not able to find it. That is your inability, don't blame me as if it's my fault.
In case if you still want to badger me with statements such as "lies" etc etc, i have found the link to this interview for you.
http://ent.sina.com.cn/s/m/49317.html
So please accept the fact that without zhang yimou, zhang ziyi will never come to where she stands today.
JJH
Tuesday, November 05, 2002 at 03:31:59 (PST)
[202.62.139.189]
"heheeeee...the recent anti-Z posts have been really lame. He's bashing MOI, and not Ziyi! Which is OK, since it proves that he really doesn't have a solid foundation for his arguments. I won't mind being bashed in the name of Ziyi.
His last post (the lone lame basher), IMO, tries to end the topic. He never answered my recent reply. Which means he's runnin' out of lies to post!
It has been really amusing fighting this fight....."
I am really bemused by this post i recently came across. It's so lame to me that someone can't even stand up for the challenge face to face. Though I know this kind of people probably lack male hormone but please, the next time say this in my face, okay. Don't cry to your big daddy, and certainly don't assert any self-claimed victories ever before the discussion ended. That is not a good practice.....*_*
Extremism adds nothing to the discussion but inflammation. One's argument should base on rationality, logicality and hopefully nonchalance. Do not be beguiled by your sensuality and obsession.
See, you keep confounding me for proof. Then i've given a fraction of the proof. You insist to interpret them the other way around, then i will explain them to you once again, in slim hope that you will understand.
I will reiterate this one last time, though you would probably discredit zhang ziyi's own words, she told reporter in an interview, as part of the ordeal she's gone through, that zhang yimou dragged her to the entrance of the village in which they filmed tRH, and slated zzy for her poor performance on the set of tRH.
This is way beyond my comprehension. It's an article posted by sina.com and it's still in sina's archive. On one hand you claim yourself to be such a dedicated fan, then on the other hand you refuse to recognize her biography. So what exactly is that?
If you are not willing, or not able to find this article, then ask me a favor to do it. Don't badger me with statements such as "lies, never answer" etc. But it's shocking nonetheless to me, that you have never come across this interview before.
Don't you understand why i posted the link in my last post? You asserted zhang yimou being perfectionist, but it's not zhang yimou's usually practice to retake a shot over and over again.
"If the greatness of an actress now solely lies on the number of fansites she has, the number of countrymen fans she has, and the make-up on her face, and NOT on pure, raw, unadulterated talent, then this world is turning into a sick, sick Hades for the artist."
In fact zhang ziyi does rely heavily on makeups on her face. She would regret deeply to show up in the camera without powder. My experience is a prime example. If she didn't forget to wear her mask that day, i will probably still be in your league today.
Without supports of fans zhang ziyi is done. One of the yardstick for greatness is public consensus, every great actor owns legions of admirers, if not fans. Otherwise bring up a counter example to prove me wrong. Who's been considered great while being hated and despised by everybody?
"Time will prove: no, Time has ALREADY proven Ziyi as a major, major talent. Its just that she's still young and some people just can't accept the fact that someone so young has achieved and accomplished so many things some "actresses" can only dream of doing in a lifetime."
Nope....(head's shaking) She got her breakthrough here and it's time for her to prove herself. Time has not proven anything yet. Zhang ziyi's performance is far from consummate. She still has lots of grounds for enhancement, granted that she is really dedicated to her craft.
JJH
Monday, November 04, 2002 at 15:13:15 (PST)
[202.62.139.74]
Yimou didn't need too many takes in that one, because to HIM, I repeat, to HIM, as the director, he was satisfied with everything. Obviously, Tony Leung and Maggie, also perfectionists and great actors themselves, didn't see in in that light. Even as actors or directors, we still have our OWN individuality and OPINIONS and TASTES.
As I said, a scene has many components: we would probably never know why Yimou was so dissastisfied with one particular scene. But I KNOW that its not because of Ziyi.
Time will prove: no, Time has ALREADY proven Ziyi as a major, major talent. Its just that she's still young and some people just can't accept the fact that someone so young has achieved and accomplished so many things some "actresses" can only dream of doing in a lifetime.
Rain
rainjin@ziyi.info
Sunday, November 03, 2002 at 20:35:35 (PST)
[202.57.91.216]
http://ent.sina.com.cn/m/c/2002-10-30/0800109626.html
Here is an interview with zhang ziyi. According to her, zhang yimou only took couple of takes to get a shot done in his latest epic "Hero". zzy's co-star Tony Leung and Maggie Cheung felt very uneasy and demanded a few more takes, because their previous collaboration with Wong Karwai would not be wrapped up until every possible angle and expression was filmed.
Zhang yimou slated zzy on the set of tRH, i don't think it has anything to do with the backdrop.
Time will prove if zhang ziyi is a major talent or lucky starlet.
JJH
Thursday, October 31, 2002 at 11:32:06 (PST)
[202.62.139.50]
Geez Louise.....
I won't wonder if a perfectionist like Yimou would want to have a scene taken over and over again. Stanley Kubrick has been known to comand 90 takes or more. But the point is: was Yimou repeating the take because of Ziyi, or because of the scene itself?
A scene has many integral parts: the setting, the mood, the actress, and etc. Yimou was repeating the take not because of Ziyi, but because of the whole scene itself. Something in it dissatisfied him, and it was definitely NOT Ziyi.
Fanclubs, Chinamen and websites: haha.
If the greatness of an actress now solely lies on the number of fansites she has, the number of countrymen fans she has, and the make-up on her face, and NOT on pure, raw, unadulterated talent, then this world is turning into a sick, sick Hades for the artist.
Ziyi rules: you go, Talent. She's a Major, Major Talent.
Rain
rainjin@ziyi.info
Wednesday, October 30, 2002 at 10:33:54 (PST)
[202.78.97.15]
Zhang Ziyi rocks!! What a great, beautiful girl. I just recently saw Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon, and I totally fell in love with her. She's just so cool, and so beautiful. I hope she'll be starring in many more films so I get to see more of her. She's the best! What more can I say?
Talent
Tuesday, October 29, 2002 at 22:51:55 (PST)
[213.225.127.189]
CastleGuard:
I really don't want to go into the discussion of the significance of this particular award, but if you insist.
One appalling phenomenon for chinese showbusiness is artists will get a share of the trophies as long as they attend the award ceremony, specially for the music industry. Lycra doesn't seem to immune from this abominable plague either.
e.g. Annita Mui, leading actress in Jackie Chan's 1995 blockbuster "Rumble in the Bronx", took home the "most fashionable asian female singer" award while ludicrously she was not even among the candidates list. The award is a mean of gratitude for showing up at the ceremony.
Of course I am not saying zzy's award is deceptive, but how real the credibility actually is?
Beside, even the credibility is 100% real, zzy didn't pick the award up by edging out "all other celebrities", there are merely three or four candidates contend alongside her for the award in this category.
My argument is weak? Website is intangible? In today's cyber era fansite is certainly one of the best yardstick to gauge stars' popularities(i stress on popularity rather than fame because one can be quite famous while being very unpopular. e.g. Bin Laden in U.S.).
Internet is probably the only place for many fans to share their affections and devotions for their beloved artists. And building fansites nowaday is one of the best ways for fans to show their dedications.
You still can't see the correlations here? Dedicated sites need dedicated persons to take good care of. The absence of fansites implies the lacks of diehard fans, of whom stem the foundations of stars' success.
Fansite indeed comes and goes, they slacken as the fans' dedications fade away. In showbusiness, that often signals the ebb of one's career.
I know you are a very dedicated fan of zzy otherwise you wouldn't compose long posts on defensive of her. But you have to come to accept the fact that zzy is rather unpopular in china, her home state.
On a global scale, she is not big enough to match hollywood stars.
About your preferred tangibles, sizzling hot stars get offers of roles from various film projects, while with heaps of commercial endorsement lay before them. This alone shows nothing.
However i agree with you that awards do measure one's talents and achievement. I must applaud for what zzy has accomplished so far in her career, at such a tender age she has aleady managed to pick up a few awards including the hundred flowers, MTV and independent spirit. But i wouldn't consider zzy the best in her field. Her uni collegue, Qin hai lu picked both the most prestigious best actress awards in hk and taiwan, so did another of her collegue Liu ye who picked up the best actor award in taiwan. Their talents have not at all been eclipsed by the success of zzy.
Certainly I am in no position of denying zhang ziyi's accomplishment. She may be the pace setter for some times, but her peers definitely rival her both in terms of beauty and talents.
Honestly zzy doesn't quite fit my definition of beauty, though she does look pretty and attractive sometimes with the right makeup and lighting.
zzy needs more showcases to display her talents and "greatness"(if she really has any). I am not greatly impressed by her roles after CTHD.
Finally, your last few sentences sound so much like slogans purposed for political propagandas to me(though in this case it involves no politics what-so-ever). Nobody is going to stop zhang ziyi, she can go anywhere as she please and as far as she can, as long as she doesn't trip over her own feet.
BTW, your post is kinda hard to read due to the constant missing of letters, and frequently pop up of question
marks.
http://newbbs5.sina.com.cn/fbin/view.pl?forumid=4018&postid=1985584
This is an interview with zzy posted by the moderator of sina.com's zzy fanclub, who is a very devoted zzy fan.
Here is the excerpt where zzy talks about what happened on the set of tRH:
"I was too anxious during filming, sometimes one shot would take 35 times, and it's been cutted from the film at last."
About zhang yimou's part, it's from another interview. zzy said zhang yimou once slated her into tear. I will try to find that for you as well, if you can't.
JJH
Sunday, October 27, 2002 at 13:14:42 (PST)
[202.62.139.178]
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